Alex Genadinik - Delight In Ecommerce Branding And Pursue Knowledge With Online Education

Alex Genadinik - Delight In Ecommerce Branding And Pursue Knowledge With Online Education
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Alex Genadinik is a serial entrepreneur, 3-time Amazon bestselling author and a top Udemy instructor with 300,000+ students. His courses range from topics like entrepreneurship, marketing, and personal development. He is also a long-time business coach having coached over 1,000 people over the years.

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Episode 63 — Alex Genadinik (Edited_Final)

Alex Genadinik: [00:00:00] Udemy is kind of, for people who are passionate about teaching and sharing what they know. People think that being a teacher is really about knowledge of a skill, but what I've learned over the years of being a teacher is that it's a small part of it, or it may be a half of it. But another part of it is can you present that information in a clear way so that less people go, I don't get it.

And we're structured is fine. And Udemy, of course, you know, you have to be good at audio, and good at video. There's all these peripheral skills. So it's really expertise, ability to read the audio or the visual ability and also teaching ability. So it's all of those things together that what makes a good teacher.

Joseph: [00:00:43] You're listening to Ecomonics, a Debutify podcast. Your resource for one of the kind of insights into the world of e-commerce and business in the modern age. This is Joseph. I'll be presenting a wealth of industry knowledge from interviews with successful business people and our own state of the art research. Your time is valuable. So let's go.

My first impression of today's guest, Alex Genadinik, started with this t-shirt brand, Wave, if you like. A small but significant gesture that can sprawl out into a lot of good, depending on the day and the weather. We also get some insights into Udemy, one of the teaching platforms we cover in recent days, Alex is one of the best on the platform.

And it shows that regardless of what you do, there's some more for you to share that to your benefit and to others as well. As long as you're at least one step from the first, it doesn't take as long to get into, as you might think, have a listen. 

Alex Genadinik, it is good to have it here on Ecomonics.

Thank you for joining us today. How are you doing? How are you feeling? 

Alex Genadinik: [00:01:42] Great. Thank you for having me. 

Joseph: [00:01:44] Thanks. Thanks for being here. So let's jump in right into this because you have a wide array of knowledge and experience, and we're going to be doing a lot of gear shifts people. So buckle up, uh, the opening question across nearly every interview podcast in history.

And it's no exception here. Uh, tell us who you are and what do you do? 

Alex Genadinik: [00:02:00] So right now, the biggest thing I do is I'm one of the top Udemy instructors, teaching marketing business, intrepreneurship things like that. I'm also a best-selling author with some of my books using universities, especially the business plan book is a popular one, and I've done a number of other online businesses like affiliate marketing, mobile apps, et cetera, et cetera, to do some music, uh, and probably 10 other things that I'm forgetting right now, but mainly today I'm also doing business coaching and essentially my core focus is, uh, teaching classes, uh, on and off you than me, but mostlyUdemy. 

Joseph: [00:02:38] Now, I, uh, here's my experience. Here's my extent of experience Udemy. Uh, new year's I think going into 2019, there was a course for.

Um, illustration, it was like five bucks. So I signed up for it. Um, and then I got like the first, the introductory for, and he said, uh, this is going to take a lot of hard work. And I said, I accept that. And then the habit just wasn't, it just didn't sink in new year's tradition. Right. Everybody goes through it.

So what I would like to know is about the interactive experience with you, to me. Um, is it. I mean, how much do the, uh, students gets to interact with you? The teacher. And I assume some of it is based on the teacher's discretion, but so, um, what is a capable of, and how do you implement it? 

Alex Genadinik: [00:03:20] Sure. So one of the values of taking a course is interaction with the instructor.

Having said that the instructors who are popular have hundreds of thousands of students. So you can't just bombard the instructor, but I try to pride myself on, you know, having world-class support and care for students. So I try to answer any questions within 24 hours or some questions. You know, if I'm online, I might answer within 10 minutes to 30 minutes, one hour, uh, just because I want the students to, you know, get past their questions and move forward and be happy with the course.

So, yeah, you're right. Like some instructors you will never hear from them, but some instructors that care actually put in the time to respond to students and. Uh, often, you know, a course can be, you know, one size fits all, but the instructor can really point a student in the right direction, solving a lot of problems with that student.

Joseph: [00:04:14] Exactly. Sometimes an instructor just needs to, um, explain things with a different syntax in order for it to sink in. Right. We all, we all learn a little bit differently and you know, this is a, it's an exciting time, especially for education because, uh, one of the conversations that I was having with my parents, um, over Christmas was like the difference between their educational experience and my educational experience.

I'm 31 years old, you know, when they, when they were in education, They were in portables and they were getting whipped to my nuns. Uh, th th they had the sticks on them. Now, granted, they turned out to be very confident people. So there's that. But when I, when I went through elementary school, I gotta be honest with you.

It was good sometimes, but it was mostly a nightmare. I did not get along with a lot of the other students in class. I have some core friends that are, I'm still friends with to this day. I didn't get along with the teachers. One of them would like see me drawing and rather than nurture my gift would like rip my drawings out from under me and says, this isn't the time he's like, well, all right, fine.

And what I found was most of my learnings and most of the skills that have stuck with me to this day, My college program was pretty good, but it's mostly just been what I had the initiative and what I did on my own, because I was so driven by my own desire to want to explore something where the energy and the.

And the passion was just coming up organically. Um, and, and that was largely been media and in podcasting and writing and creativity and all that. What I'm wondering about with the Udemy program is, or, you know, with, with your experience in online education as a whole is, um, what happens after, um, are people able to take this knowledge and, uh, Really turn this into a business venture for them.

I don't know if people really understand the value of a uni degrees in compared to like a college degree, which also if you, statistically speaking, college degrees or degrees are valuable. So I'm not so much. I know that was a lot there to unpack, but whenever I get to think about my past, it comes out. 

Alex Genadinik: [00:06:10] I actually have some similarities, you know, I really feel like education-wise.

Uh, after high school, it was a wasteland purely education wise. I mean, it was fun with friends, but there was not much education, but in college where I was, where I really got to explore my curiosities. And, um, actually those curiosities really drove my career because I was curious, I was a computer science major, but I was curious about creative writing that led into writing music, writing books.

I was curious about so many things, um, that. Always end up finding their way into my current work that makes it different and in a way better. Um, so I actually, and that curiosity was actually the driver for all of it. And I was actually really pleasantly surprised to hear you say that because not many people would say that.

And I really relate to that. Um, now to your question about, you know, where does  fit in? So students on you to meet, they have a few different needs, uh, The primary need is if you have some career goal, you want to start a business, you want to get a job. You want to learn, you know, up-skill, that's the current term.

Udemy is fantastic for that, because now it's funny to say, I'm going to go get a certificate. That's going to cost thousands of dollars to learn Twitter. No, it just go to you to me or take a Twitter marketing course tomorrow. You'll know everything you need to know about Twitter marketing. So those kinds of problems, like those kinds of scenarios, Udemy solves really well.

You don't need, you could take a long, you know, um, in-person course on any topic, but if you were self sort of a self starter, you really don't need to do that. You can go a long way with Udemy. And it's just for $10 essentially. Or, you know, they constantly have discounts. Um, Oh yeah, there's also another kind of student that the curious student, right.

This will be more along your lines where, you know, if you're taking a drawing class, it's more for your inner growth in a way there's also that student on you to meet it. It's, it's a less. It's less of a drive because obviously career and money is the number one driver for e-learning. But, uh, certainly there's, you know, I I'm a student of the, of the, the kind that's, you know, pursuing their curiosities.

Like I constantly take classes on things that are like, you know, other people wouldn't like emotional intelligence or music or stuff like this that people are like, well, why is, you know, this is how, how are you going to make money with this? And I have to explain people to people. This is not for money.

Joseph: [00:08:44] Yeah. I, I, that's why I, the, the distinction I've always felt was important to draw between college and university. I always saw college was place for to learn something, um, and craft or in a trade or somewhere that can get people into the workforce. Whereas I always thought university was more of like the philosophical and the theoretical, uh, to really be able to understand something on a, on a deeper level.

Um, I don't think that's really what the educational system has conveyed. I think now people see college as a prerequisite for university and university is a prerequisite for paid work. Hopefully. 

Alex Genadinik: [00:09:18] Yeah, I w I would also almost just take a step back and say, um, you know, college or university, essentially, it's a vocational school for the most part.

Right. You're there, you're just kind of training to get a job, but it's not, it doesn't necessarily mean that you're getting an education. Like you don't know Shakespeare, you know, you might not know Shakespeare opera or writing or, and people might say, well, why do I need opera? Well, is really that's the role of education is for your own inner growth.

So that you're, you know, you have a richer life and I don't know that. Current education system. The university-based education system really provides that. If I just stuck to my computer science training, I will get zero of that. It's like for the malt, essentially, almost zero of that. And it had to be on my own initiative.

Joseph: [00:10:07] So I wasn't expecting to, uh, to bring this up, but I've had this theory about educational reform. Um, if it's cool with you, I'd love to talk to you about it. I know it's my show and everything, but, you know, your time is really valuable. So I just wanted to, uh, uh, buffer that. So what I, like I was saying how my parents had their experience.

I had my experience and you know, my parents' generation, they made improvements to the system. Um, so I didn't have to go through what they went through and I feel that my generation. Um, should do the same. And what I want to see in schools is I think the grading system is effective and helping people have like a tangible sense of where they are.

But what I don't think is effective is the pressure too. Accomplish all of that within a year, given the vast disparity of people's educational and intellectual, um, strengths and weaknesses. So what I would like to see is more of like a community center version of it, where people of any age, frankly.

Okay. Maybe you separate the kids and the adults, but, uh, can sign up for a grade level class, take the class at their own leisure. And look at education and school as more of like a lifelong pursuit. I'm applying. I wanna apply for a job. I need a grade 12 level math right now. My frankly, my math is probably grade three right now anyways.

So I gotta go. I gotta go sign up for math classes. I show up to school, uh, once a week on a Thursday evening and my classroom is. People all over the have Wiz kids who are like excelling. You have people who are not only learning math, but they're learning English. So they're just trying to absorb whatever they can absorb.

And you walk away meeting people with vastly different experiences. And I think it's a lot more enriching that way. So that's what I would like to see in the education. I'd be welcome to, uh, comment on that, but I'd also like to know if you've had any thoughts along these lines of what you'd like to see happen to the educational system.

Alex Genadinik: [00:11:58] I don't know that I have ideas that are of, you know, of any value that you know, out, you know, that are outstanding ideas in this, um, that are too worthwhile. But what I notice in my work is that, you know, I spent a lot of time, um, with people who are adult learners, who maybe, um, like didn't take up some skills.

Early on, and this is all kinds of skills, largely personal development skills. So what I work with people on is like, you know, people who have like, for example, confidence issues, and this will come back to your points early on, like during their high school and early college, they don't speak up. They don't, uh, show their worth and the teachers don't know to help them with.

The thing that they're good at, whereas the louder kids, the more confident ones, the stronger ones, you know, there's a kind of a hierarchy in school. They get all, they get more of the attention that it's not necessarily that they're more talented, but they're more out there and they get more attention.

And of course, teachers know here's how we're going to help you. And a lot of the, uh, quieter kids may be. Just less vocal, less, you know, more, uh, less confident. They just don't get that support. And they don't realize as they grow, they don't realize their own strengths because internally they kind of have a voice saying, you know, I'm good at something, but it doesn't get reflected back to them by the education system.

Just because the education system doesn't actually even know that this kid maybe wants to excel at something. And actually this was the case for me. Like I had all these things I wanted to explore early on, but I was so young, it was only a faint voice. I didn't know how to express to my teachers or anybody that I, Hey, I want to do this and I want to do that.

And so I just sort of, nobody did that for me. And I only realized, Oh my God, like I would have realized so much more potential. If there was a way, you know, um, for me to communicate that somehow by some miracle. Um, and I noticed a lot of really intelligent people. Typically they are the quieter ones. And typically this is their experience in school.

Is that. You know, they kind of have to play catch up later to realize their potential. Um, so I don't know if I have a great solution for this, but I noticed this trend, uh, extended, you know, it re repeating itself time and time again. And it's a little heartbreaking because the people who. You know, kind of have, um, potential aren't realizing it and there's, and in a way help us so close, but yet kind of so far that that's really maybe a really long way to express wanting.

One thing that I think is interesting that I see. 

Joseph: [00:14:49] Yeah, it brought up a couple of thoughts on my side as well. One of them is that. I, I don't know if advantage it's an advantageous to introverts or extroverts because the more extroverted ones will run a foul more of the teachers anyways, in depending on their own.

Charisma and strength level. Uh, they might end up running a fellow of their peers. And then you have introverts who are just trying to survive, you know, six, eight hours in classroom, keeping their head down. Hopefully, uh, they don't, uh, they don't end up being the center of attention in a way they don't like, um, one thing I will say, because I've had a couple of friends in the past who were definitely more of the, the extroverted type, where they would have no problems speaking out more often and expressing themselves more often, I will say I did notice that there they were more street smart. And I want to say in a nicer way than street smart, their social intelligence was higher because I think they had a higher degree of social interactions because they were putting themselves in more, more often, they got more feedback for it and they were more adept at navigating socially.

Um, so one of my friends, he, he was great on Tinder. Like he was, he was great at, uh, hosting parties because he was. He was socially intelligent and I'm more than happy to grant him that because there was a, the results spoke for themselves. Um, the other, the other thing I wanted to, uh, actually ask you about too, was, um, because you were saying like emotional intelligence and I can't remember if I've asked anybody about this before, but, um, what do you characterize that emotional intelligence as exactly?

Alex Genadinik: [00:16:16] This is a really good question. And the answers to that will be an extremely long answer. So I'm going to try to keep it short. So there's. There's a couple of ways to look at it. Um, one way to look at it is, you know, obviously there's a kind of a current leader, you know, kind of proponent of this, or, you know, the guy who's driving, this is Daniel Goldman.

His, he's got a popular book on this and it's largely focusing on, he's not a researcher by the way. He's just explaining what researchers have come up with. Um, but he's very good at like marketing and promotion and yeah, so. Uh, in his world, obviously he's very business savvy, so she's focused on corporate, uh, focus to it.

So like, how do you manage your emotion in the corporate world? If you get angry, you know, take a step back. Don't let you know these kinds of things. And I think there are purists in emotional intelligence who would say that's fantastic. But it's so limited. And, um, you know, there's people who have been exploring emotional intelligence for thousands of years.

Like Aristotle, if you, if you look at a lot of his, in the Nicomachean ethics, my pronunciation of that is just bad. But, um, you know, there's a lot of like inklings of, you know, what is, you know, what are the right emotions to have? What are the right work to do well? How do you match them up? What work, what work makes you happy?

How do you determine that? The, you know, he actually, I think was one of the philosophers who, uh, started to deeply look into that. But if I was to look at emotional intelligence, um, taking in Daniel Goldman's work the Iris title, everything in between. Um, and I've taken some classes on this, but you know, the purist professors who, uh, were looking at, um, All the research.

Just how does it pertain to the individual? There's a very interesting way. I think if I was to find one anecdote. Yeah, I, there there's this, there was this, uh, I'll give you a case study. There's this was this individual decades ago and he was very bright lawyer. He got into an accident. And, you know, he had some brain damage and what they found out that like, he could actually, he recovered all the logic, all the logic he could still perform, but he lost some emotional, the part that connected his brain to the emotional centers got cut.

And he was extremely bad at becoming, staying a lawyer. Right. He couldn't hold a job, any job, he and people, the, the, the, the scientific community. Got curious with this guy, like he retained all the logic. Why not? And will they really determine? And I think the, the main researcher was that Tony Demasio, I'm not a hundred percent sure on the main researcher, but if anybody wants to look into that, but the finding was that even though we think that our decisions are logical, how do you know a or B is better?

That's emotional. And when you lose that emotional inputs to every one of your decisions, that's, that's showing how deeply, you know, um, how deep emotions control us. Right. We think we're logical, but in every even logical decision to know is a better or B that's emotional, you know, and sometimes emotions, um, make hard decisions.

Like, you know, if you have a chocolate in your one hand and the vegetable, another hand, Even before you had time to think about it. And even before, um, any logic has happened, your hand is pulling towards the chocolate, right. You know what you like better and just regarding brain chemistry or structure, you know, the part, the process.

The Mo the processes of the emotions is, uh, you know, it's, it's lower in the brainstem, the amygdala, uh, and obviously there's related parts, and I'm not a brain scientist by any means, but, um, the part that does the logic takes a little longer to fire. So he's first, the first trigger is your emotions. Um, and so the emotional intelligence, like really, it is most of are our days made up of is, is the emotions in the more we sort of focus on them and take control of it rather than it of us. Um, the more interesting sort of like our lives can become because we started to control them more. 

Joseph: [00:20:41] So there was one observation, I unearth from that, um, which is how you were saying that the majority of decisions, um, can be emotional over logical.

And, and yet someone, one might think that they're making a logical decision and. The, what I thought was, if someone is making a logical decision, what they're trying to do is decide between the positive outcome and a negative outcome, and the positive outcome should make a person feel better. So I think that right there is the thought process between from, okay, well, it seems, it seems logical to, well, I'm an I icon, I always try to picture putting myself in Spock's shoes for a second there.

I'm just trying to think of like, what would be like a, a star Trek example of that. Uh, but yeah, no, that's, that's fascinating. And so, um, I wanted to get back to, that's the thing I wanted to ask you about, um, with you, to me. Um, and then we'll, we'll we'll shift gears. Um, one of them is. Actually one thing real quick.

Cause I didn't write this down, but how many classes do you have right now? 

Alex Genadinik: [00:21:37] I think it's something like 130 now. 

Joseph: [00:21:39] 130. Okay. So how are you dealing with the, uh, assuming this is an issue and pressure to update them as just in case the information needs to be, um, brought up to speed in case something ends up not being relevant.

Uh, is that something that you've run into? 

Alex Genadinik: [00:21:57] Yeah, so, um, it's a big part of what I do is actually. Improve existing classes instead of creating new ones. And I'm constantly telling myself this month, I'm creating zero new classes, just focusing on improving my existing classes. And when I say that to myself, I'm totally honest with myself.

And then I ended up creating more classes. Uh, this has been going on for years, and that's why I have 130 classes. But, but, but it's, it is still true that, uh, maybe half of my time or most of my time is spent. Uh, creating, uh, improvements in my current classes because I do keep them updated. Um, and, uh, you know, there's all kinds of updates.

Sometimes necessitated by changes in, let's say the SEO class, you know, there's changes every few months or so, but sometimes students point out, Oh, the audio in this video is not so good. So I have to go in and fix that. And then it has to still fit with all the other lecturers and other students complain about, Hey, you fix that, but create another problem here.

So there's a lot of this. And, uh, this is actually I think in all business world or startup world, or, you know, even mobile apps when I worked on them, it was the same principle. There's, you know, as the entrepreneur, you want to over a feature, you want to build, you want to create stuff and it's less fun.

To, you know, test and fix bugs and, uh, you know, but actually the product really blossoms and improves after testing and all the boring things, testing, improving retesting, retesting, and you know, and you think like, Oh yeah, I tested it already. It's great. And then somebody starts complaining now there's still a problem.

And you think, I think. It can be, then I go and look and yes, it can be. So, and I literally am dealing with this, like literally today I'm having this issue where some audio is, you know, there's a million things can go wrong. And so I definitely allocate a ton of time to improve existing courses. 

Joseph: [00:23:57] Uh, I I'm, I just put myself in the, in the position of a, um, uh, an instructor myself for a moment there.

And I just pictured somebody with, send me a message just simply saying I don't get it. And I feel like that would just make me want to throw my table out the window. 

Alex Genadinik: [00:24:10] There is a lot of this, um, but sometimes you get feedback from students that doesn't make sense. And. The earlier me would be like, it's the student's fault.

But the current me would be like, probably if they don't get it and they could only express that they don't get it. I just wasn't clear enough. And so my questions then would be which lecture, what was wrong. If they give me at least the lecture, I'll go, literally going, watch the video, put myself into the shoes of the student and see was it confusing?

Oftentimes I probably maybe skipped some things wasn't thorough enough. Didn't show a thing. So I'll refilm it and I'll actually send a thank you to that student saying, Hey, you know, I did make the lecture better for you and also for everyone in the future. So thank you. 

Joseph: [00:24:58] And it's important too, to get that, get that feedback in aggregate, and then it's probably better for your, uh, for your energy expenditure to then fix that video.

Cause then otherwise, if you can solve the problem for tens, if not hundreds of students, when speaking out, but a hundred of them aren't saying anything, then that's probably a lot better on the psyche.

Alex Genadinik: [00:25:18] Yeah, exactly. Like if one person said something, you can bet 50 people experienced it already. 

Joseph: [00:25:24] Um, okay.

So one thing I'm wondering about as well with the you, to me is one of the things I like to courage people to think about when they're in e-commerce is, you know, our, our core audience are, um, are on Shopify and they're dropshippers, and there are a lots of different paths that people can take. And I think you had immediate was definitely one of them, but can you make any recommendations for like what levels of expertise or even credentials somebody should have if they watch to be an instructor themselves? 

Alex Genadinik: [00:25:52] I think the theoretical answer is you should be a super expert professor, but most people aren't and Udemy is for people who aren't, that Udemy is kind of, for people who are passionate about teaching and sharing what they know, and also are like a good intermediate level.

Like you should definitely not be a beginner, but if you're teaching beginners, Like, if I'm learning chess, I don't need the class from a Grandmaster. I need a class from somebody, you know, who has 10 years experience and pretty good at it. Five years experience is totally fine. I just need to learn, you know, how did the pieces move?

Uh, what are the openings, you know, like what are the standard things? So I don't need to know how to think that moves ahead. It's overkill and it's probably very boring for the teacher to teach. They can't put themselves in my shoes. So. So a tremendous professor would actually be a little bit of a mismatch for the beginner.

So solid intermediate, or intermediate to advanced actually a really good level to become a teacher. Having said that being a teacher is people think that being a teacher is really about, you know, knowledge of a skill, but what I've learned over the years of being a teacher is. That's a small part of it, or maybe a half of it, the part, but another part of it is can you present that information in a clear way so that less people go, I don't get it.

And the core structure is fine. And with you, to me, of course, you know, you have to be good at audio with good video. There's all these peripheral skills. So it's really expertise. Uh, AB you know, ability to create the audio, audio, visual ability, and also, uh, teaching ability. So it's all of those things together is what makes a good teacher.

Joseph: [00:27:34] Yeah. And, and I guess further to that point as well is that you don't have the luxury of kids being okay. I was, I was going to say confined. W it's just technically true, but also technically not true, but kids are, I dunno, there was no other word for, I forget it. Um, they're confined to the classroom for, you know, two hours, three hours.

Uh, and there was a lot of bad news bears that would arise if they were to leave. So. I think there's a, there's a more, I don't know, there's more leeway for teachers. I had one class, by the way, I had a marketing class in high school teacher didn't even teach. We had, we, we spent half the class playing worms, so there was a, you know, what can we do?

Right. We still had to check the boxes and we still wanted to get a credit so we can pass and get out of there. Um, but you hear it. You just wanna hear what he just said, that they would just get out of there. Um, whereas the incentive of people, I think there's also a little bit of leeway where I guess people are like, They're self motivated.

So they want to, they want to sit, they want to learn. So, um, there is an element of that too, but nonetheless, yeah, you're, you're making a fantastic point. Is that teaching a core element of it is public speaking and it's important to be engaging and make sure that people can understand or, and are compelled to keep listening and form a connection with you because the students definitely remember their teachers.

I know, I assume that teachers remember some students that like, you know, were significant in some ways, especially if a student ends up becoming like Keanu Reeves or something like that. But for the most part, I definitely think it's more on the side of like the student definitely remembers a teacher a lot more, just the 30 to one ratio.

Alex Genadinik: [00:29:06] Yeah. Also, you know, I had this epiphany for myself. This is after years of teaching during my testing sometimes, you know, can you, you know, it's one thing to listen, you know, when you're not confined, right. When you have the choice to leave at any moment, you know, to make it. Through a course, as a student.

Now it's a whole new level of boring when you have to listen to your own thing that you filmed for testing. Right? So my aunt, that realization and test that I have is some lectures that I filmed. I am actually interested. Like I already know what's coming because I did it. And. I know the subject matter, Irish on that thing a bunch of times, but sometimes I can present it in such a way and use the right kinds of tones and the right kind of logical structure that I don't lose myself.

Even as a listener, even though myself, I'm very bored of myself. Right. But I can tell, Oh wow. This lecture is well-made, I'm keeping my own interest and I'm, I can respect the teacher, whereas maybe some older videos or some other ones. You know, they just don't do it for me, my mind drifts. And I listened again, maybe I got distracted at the same thing, happens on some part, my mind drifts.

So it's really like just perfecting your own presentation as an instructor to the, to some kind of crazy level that I didn't even think was possible sometimes. Um, that, uh, you know, like there's just kind of epiphany that I had for myself that I didn't even realize it was possible. There's so in the, you know, to that point of keeping the students interest level, um, you know, as an instructor, you have to really improve your craft.

And, you know, in the regular classroom, the teachers, they don't actually have to do it. I listened to a lot of college lectures on YouTube and, you know, the percent that the presenting is okay. Mostly not grades, uh, especially if they get into like, you know, PhD student, they, they, they, they're not presenting really well.

They don't captivate, but, uh, and they're not really graded on it. You know, the class is fine anyway, but as an online instructor, I mean, you, if you don't present while people leave, people leave bad reviews. It's intense. So you, so the pressure to improve is, is, is really strong. So it had to kind of go through that evolution and that's fantastic.

Joseph: [00:31:30] And. I then there, there's certainly plenty of avenues for people who are compelled to do it, which is great. We live in a great time where people who want to speak, have the opportunity to speak, um, and I'll leave it at that. Cause we, uh, I want to do some, some gear shifting here.

What I did was I, I look at, uh, I looked at your website. I looked at some of your material and as usual, I always try to find things that are distinct. I try to avoid asking questions that have already been asked and. One of your most popular videos, over 122,000 views is on KPIs, which has key performance indicators.

Now this might not be. As a shuffle, I was about to here's what I was going to say. And then I realized it was wrong. It might not be as important for someone just running their own business, uh, versus running a business for others, um, which I might slink by on a mere technicality. But forget it, KPIs are important regardless of Singapore's person operation or not.

And I'll me personally, I had a bad history with KPIs, uh, because I've been in a lot of retail spaces in sales jobs. What I found was KPIs were something that I was instructed on and reviewed on. I wasn't always happy with the way it was influencing behavior. So in a sales position, let's just say a customer walks in.

I spent an hour, 30 minutes to an hour with them, uh, and. It, I didn't close. So they come in the next day there, they thought it over. Uh, they actually, I'll a quick, quick aside, whenever customers would say, Oh, I'll, I'll have to think about it. I always imagined that they go to the Harbor front and they just lean up on the railing and they watch the, the sunset and the seagulls flocked by that's always what, yeah.

So with that said, you know, they come back in the next day. I'm not in somebody else's in. And they have their sales goal to me that day. So they're going to, they're going to take the sale. Um, there have been times, like I did work in another store where we didn't do that. We were really cool, but that was more of the exception than the norm.

So. Uh, in your experience, um, how have you been able to analyze KPIs correctly? Um, and by chance, have you noticed times where KPIs were not implemented correctly and they were actually a bad influence? 

Alex Genadinik: [00:33:37] That's a good question. So KPIs that, by the way, that video is really old and I'm embarrassed of it by now, but the reference, but like KPIs, I mean, In the right time and place, they are really important, I think for any kind of new business or anything, anytime you create anything, there's the onboarding KPIs like sales conversion rate, uh, user onboarding, you know, how.

Well, they make it through your funnel and those just purely, technically, right? Cause you mentioned there's a human element in the KPIs you mentioned, but you're in an online world. There's like, it's just hard. Math is like, is it 7% or 8%? Well, let's make it 9%. And they're really important to track because in a way, if you can't track, let's say your marketing effectiveness or your, or your action.

Well, if you can track it. That's KPI. If you can track it, how do you make a decision on top of how do you make the next decision of you're flying blind? So in some sense you can't do without it, you can, but then it's fraught there. So it's ill-advised on the other hand, there's, uh, it's, it's hard to find sometimes it's hard to find the precise KPI, for example, like in my courses, There's data I get from Udemy of like how many students quit videos or how many students may be quit hourly, whatever like that.

Right. So that's a great KPI. Like I try to have like, as much as possible completion rate as, as I can. And if I see one video is having like a 70% completion rate, another video is having all the other videos are like 90% completion rates then I think, okay. I got to look at that. So, so that's really helpful.

But on the other hand, There's the human intangibles. Like there's this anecdote, like for the longest time students were commenting on one of my courses. You speak too fast. And so I went in and I just slowed down. Nevermind. They can listen at 0.5 speed or 0.7, five. Okay. Let's say they don't know that.

Then I went in, changed. Somethings spoke slowly, kept getting those comments. I spot you speak too fast and they're still, they're still, you know, Those those hard metrics, the number numerical metrics, we're still kind of similar. So I couldn't use that. You know, there was not enough information there. The students were still telling me I'm like, I can't slow down anymore because then some students will say you speak too slow.

And so then like for the nth time I went in and I literally tested, I watched the video purely intensely focused on what was wrong with the video. And it wasn't that I was speaking too fast. It was some concepts were complicated and, and they were just a little confusing. And so I took that video, broke it down into two videos.

Never got that comment again. So really when they were saying you're kicked too fast, but really Mendez the thing is just confusing and there's no way to get this right. So from a KPI, like you can get half of the story, like maybe they're struggling with, you know, the completion rate may be a little low because they got frustrated and quit, but you'd never know the root cause until you kind of.

Sort of talk to the people, tested and tested. Um, but certainly KPI's can give you a clue. Um, they can give you a clue. Yeah. That's a fantastic way of characterizing it. You can rely on any software like analytics, KPI data. This is a tool it's not everything you should use is then, you know, you're just, you're not, you're not accounting for the human element of it.

Joseph: [00:37:18] I'm not sure like where, what, what exactly is the point that I want to make? But I will say that I think the human element is always like the root of this, because we don't get that data without human behavior. So all of that data does communicate something. And what we, what we were saying about how if one person is speaking up over it, That means 50 other people are having the same problem.

They're just not saying anything. So in a way, you are taking the pressure off of them where they just going to be themselves, they're just going to behave and then the data will reflect whatever their behavior is. So, yeah, I mean, there is, there is human added, a human element to it, but. Um, and then also, what was the other point they were making too about logic and emotional intelligence is that when we're making a logical decision based off of the data here, but once we get past that layer, we get down and it's, it's still, uh, largely emotional as well.

So it's just a lot of stuff. That's like synopsis just firing off in my head. Right. So I'm going to, I'm going to shift gears again. So. The, we talked to somebody else about, uh, uh, private label rights. Uh, and for those of you who lives in that episode, I acknowledge at one point I switched it around and it was PRL by accident.

I recognize that I'm moving on. So I want to use my own, uh, store as an example. So over the course of this series, I wasn't doing a store at first, but after listening and being inspired by over 45 50 people at this point, Yeah, I okay. You know, I'm, I'm, I'm running, my I'm gonna run my own. I got all the tools.

I got all the resources. Like I can do this. Um, so I settled on the home office and nation. The reason why I settled on it was because, um, I've been working remotely for seven years when I started freelancing and audio editing. Uh, I'd done some sales jobs, freelancing. This is remote. So I'm passionate about it.

I think it's great to have a home office and to have a creative element to. And efficient workspace. So we don't get that if we were to go into like a WeWork or something. So with private label rights, um, again, we, we should know what the, what these are, but. What prerequisite should my site have, or should I look into, uh, before I, uh, acquire one of these, and then if you want to take me through the acquisition process, that would be great.

Alex Genadinik: [00:39:27] Are you talking about specifically about my courses, private label rights, or?

Joseph: [00:39:31] I did look through the list of that. Um, but I didn't like absorb which ones exactly it would relevant to me. So if one is relevant, that would be fantastic, but I didn't mean the question in general. 

Alex Genadinik: [00:39:41] So privately private label rights is kind of a broad concept because if you apply them to a, a widget, you can put your logo on a widget and Hey, it's my, it's my logo.

It's my widget. And so there's a lot of companies let's say in China who have made any tangible item, allow you to white label say, Hey, not now it's my brand, but, uh, And that's fine. And that's the pure version of this private label rights, because, you know, you have the rights that you have your contract, your law, your logos on it.

Great. Um, with courses it's a little different because it's never a pure situation like that because there's somebody presenting who is that like, sometimes I'm in the video, but even if I'm not in the video, it's by voice who is that? It's not like you can say I made it, especially, let's say a woman.

Licenses, the course is a man's voice presenting. She can't say I made it or, you know, and probably the same thing for male voices too. We don't all sound the same. So, uh, there is this element of like, you have to say, there is an instructor, the course is made by our BR you know, it belongs to our brand. We partnered or whatever the phrasing might be, but there is a certain instructor in the course, which that instructor element doesn't, uh, take place in the widget.

World, you know, so that's a little different, but I think for the home office space, let's say, I mean the home office space is great because, well, everybody's doing home office and there's a whole solo preneur movement. That's been around for awhile. Now the corporate world joined. The home office space, which is fantastic for your niche because now your initial balloons.

But, um, I mean, you've, you've be the thing that was the corporate office, all that money went to the home office. So for you, that's great. But if you were to pick an initial, let's say like a solopreneur or even up-skill, then approximately half of my courses would apply to your store. Right. If you want it to sell things.

Um, and, and so. Just like a widget you get from China or somewhere will be made for you. You can generally the way my, uh, private label rights works, it's pretty simple. You pick the courses you want. Once, you know, this objection is made, you can edit any part of them. If you want to put your branding, your logo on it, it's fine.

You can change the name and title. And then overnight you get this content that, you know, kind of taken me years to create. Uh, and you can get any size library of it. You want then keep lifetime revenue off of it. Right? So if you can sell. That's really great, because like, the problem I have is that most of my time is spent.

Refilming creating you solve that entirely. And all you have to do is sell. If you can't sell, that's a bad experience because then, you know, the problem with private label rights is almost always, there's an upfront payment, which is a problem. It's a risk. Um, so you have to prove that your store is able to sell stuff.

Once you know that you have a customer base who's consistent who buy. This is fantastic because you've kind of, you know, there's always some risks, but not as much risk. And if you can sell, you know, your production costs as low, essentially just the one-time payment and then you keep, uh, revenue lifetime in a update the courses.

So I'll get the updates. So, yeah, so like, you know, it works indefinitely, so. That's how selling courses might work. It's not a common case for Shopify stores. It's, it's more, a courses is more a case for like, if you have, uh, like teachable, you know, those course platforms that allow you to create a course site on your, uh, website.

That's the more common scenario people come to me for licensing the courses when they have like a Thinkific or teachable store. Um, and it's a little less common for Shopify, but I can see how it can work with Shopify. 

Joseph: [00:43:47] Yeah. Um, cause I, I would say that. In its present state, if it was just a, um, a drop shipping fulfillment store, uh, I've seen plenty of them.

And I, and I know what their, what their, what their game is. It's, uh, it's testing products, uh, seeing what they can turn into a winner and then, uh, you know, they'll move on to other products and. In order for, I think for it to be a good fit, the store has to evolve as a brand. And that's something that I definitely want to do too, which is again, why it's important for us to keep it, to pick issues that they're interested in, uh, that they have passion for.

Um, we run stores. If I'm going to run a store, I want to buy the products myself. Um, and oftentimes I do because it's good to test the products out and just, uh, just to make sure. Um, and also thank you by the way for clearing up. Uh, when I said that P um, private label rights, I did think it was specifically about courses, but it's much more broad than that. It can be, uh, applications. I would say by the way, I didn't actually think about that. I didn't realize that applications could be a private label or widgets, as you're saying.

Alex Genadinik: [00:44:46] The like kind of things you can hold in your hand, not necessarily a phone app, but like, uh, you know, like.

Any product you might buy on Amazon? A lot of them are. 

Joseph: [00:44:54] Oh, okay. Sorry. Okay. Thank you again for clearing that up. Cause when I, when I hear widgets, I habitually go towards, um, WordPress, widgets and plugins stuff like that

I thought were pressed with just with old school. But that's a, that's where we are now. You're you're two for two on that one. Thank you.

Okay. So, uh, we're gonna, we're gonna shift gears again. So this one, by the way, this is. Question. I was planning on asking a way before, but you see what I was saying about how these things they unfold organically. So I want to talk about way if you like, which is, um, your, your, your store right now, and the reason why I want to talk about it, because I think it really reflects a lot of your personality and the positivity that you want to express to others.

Uh, you guys can't see him right now, but he's got a blue background and even a blue, the choice of a blue background, I think. Communicate something versus, I don't know if somebody goes with green and green is a good color too, but there's, I don't know. It just, it just stuck out to me like the sky in the background and, and, and the smiling face and it just, it makes me feel, it makes me feel better.

Alex Genadinik: [00:45:56] Thank you. 

Joseph: [00:45:57] Yeah, you're welcome. Uh, one of the through lines of this program is the origin of a business. It starts with a personal desire to solve a problem. Like with a, with a store that I'm running. Um, so yeah, where did this idea came from? And, you know, what's your 10 K foot overview of it. We want to accomplish with it.

Are you using it to test things? Uh, take it away.

Alex Genadinik: [00:46:14] So wave, if you like was kind of born. I was walking down the street, listening to music and really being into my music in my, you know, but in my head, in my headphones, nobody outside. My head knew this, you know, and I like, you know, I like some esoteric music and I was like, wouldn't it be so cool if like somebody else who liked that music, if I knew who they were and they knew that I was listening to it.

And we would sort of sort of share that experience because, you know, if, if you could think of a song or a musician that you're passionate about the most. People tend to be people who are into music. People who are not, they're not, but like people who are into music, they're like, Oh my God. Yeah. I love them too.

Oh yeah. Right. They have this level of experience and maybe they don't know what to do after like, okay. You like them? I like them. But, but in that moment they're like, Oh yes, this, this, this is great euphoric moment. And I was like, well, wouldn't it be amazing if any, every person that I pass by that shared that passion for that specific musician or song I could share that.

You know, because we are kind of, you know, more and more isolated in our devices and things, but we're still, you know, we we're still meant to be social. Right. We still meant to share experiences. And I thought, well, what if I, you know, what if I would just, what would happen if I saw that person? Well, I guess I would just wave with them and they would know.

Right. So that's how I thought, well, what if I were the face of that guy, the musician, um, on my shirt. And it says, where do you feel like if people would know. They would see, Oh, it's that guy and wave now. It's not legal to put people's faces on t-shirts, especially, uh, you know, brands and like musicians, but concepts and ideas.

Um, you can, so that's how that idea was born. As I thought, well, People should people want to find others who are passionate about what they are, but they have no idea who they are. And those people don't know to express that to other people. So it kind of stays hidden because most people aren't passionate about that music that I like.

I can't comprehend why, but like, Most people aren't right. It's incomprehensible to me. Like I would think, Oh my God, like, everyone should love this, but they don't. It'd be amazing to find the people who do. And so I created this brand and you know, I first I made the t-shirts for myself. I, I, I made. All the t-shirts I wanted for people to like to wave to me.

And, uh, there's just one like Russian singer. Who's a little older, you know, he was popular. He was like a Bob Dylan of Russia, I guess you can kind of simplify and say, so the only people that really would recognize him as like all the Russian people that would walk around and, you know, Maybe they can't see very well yet.

So they gave me like, these weird looks like, are you for real? Like, they don't wave to me the weirdest, like curious looks and I think, Oh yeah, they, they, they got it, but they didn't get it fast enough. But I have that experience with them where, you know, they, they, uh, They, they, they see the shirt, they almost wave, but they don't wave.

But, but I did make a few shirts like that for myself. And it was really actually fun to wear them because every time I wore them, I walk outside. It's like an adventure waiting to happen because. Like, who's going to wave. I'm curious myself.

Joseph: [00:49:29] Because one thing that made me think about is the last time I went to, uh, I know I talked about before we started recording that I'm into sky, but there's also an Australian band that are like my favorite band, which is the cat empire.

And I went to go see their show on 2015. It was a while ago. And, and I know everybody there is a fan. Well, you get like a couple of people who are like, Ooh, these guys, they just, I don't know. They happen to be on the street at the time. A very rare anomaly. I don't think it comes up often, but, you know.

Okay. Um, but everybody, there was a fan. Right. And yet. I didn't connect with very many people. I added one guy as a friend on Facebook and we haven't talked since it was and that's, and that's it. So I think what happens is that you have a feast or famine uh we're. We have these opportunities to connect with loads of people, but it's hard to do.

So it's kind of like, I've always had the combination with networking events. I know the great and everything, and I can't wait to go to one, but I don't know. . The, the, the motive of it is always like, wait, Hey yeah. Nice to meet you. So how can I extract value from you? Like, that's basically what happens. So what you're doing is you're, you're kind of like pacing yourself.

You're giving yourself opportunities for a couple of meaningful interactions, but better than none, and probably also better than a hundred all at once.

Alex Genadinik: [00:50:47] I think so. I think, you know, I think there's this, no, I'm not doing online, dating a married, but like, When I was, there was, it was very obvious this thing where like, if you have so much choice, every individual choice becomes less worthwhile, right?

Like devalues the individual a little bit. And when you have few little choice, one is like, Oh my God, it's the one. So maybe that it would be helpful here because it's, you know, one at a time kind of. 

Joseph: [00:51:15] Yeah. I mean, for me, the way I would approach that is I think my own, um, belief in like predestination and spiritual guidance.

And so the things that we encounter are, are there and we have to set our intentions if we don't set our intentions and we can't communicate with the, uh, with the universe about what we want and the universe can't accommodate for that. Um, so setting our attention to the, wearing a shirt, saying, wave, if you like beer, You know, that's, that's a very clear way to set an intention in a way that's like, it's, it's humble too.

Right. Cause you know that you're kind of putting yourself out there a little bit. 

Alex Genadinik: [00:51:47] It is a little bit every once in a while when I do go out, when I have a confident day, I'm like, yeah. When I have a less, a little bit of like a less social day, I'm like, Hmm, do I really want to put myself out there? But, but it's nice.

Like, it's, it's a fun thing in the end. And it's a conversation starter and you know, one reason I liked about it that I liked it is because it's a conversation starter. It's a little bit, you know, it makes it more brandable like memorable and that's one thing I thought would kind of give it life as a brand a little bit, there just a.

Side 0.1, because earlier we were talking about, you know, choosing some branding.

Joseph: [00:52:21] And, uh, and last question about that before we move on to it. But, um, do you have a vision for where you want to go with it? Do you want to get it into stores? Uh, where, where are you? How are you working on it? 

Alex Genadinik: [00:52:31] Uh, I mean, I don't see being sold in stores in the, any sort of foreseeable future, or I'm not even thinking about it, but really, um, it's an Etsy, Amazon Shopify play.

And maybe a few of the smaller, uh, you know, fashion retailers, like, you know, these or in red Bumble and ones like that. But really there's an issue of focus where it's not me, even my main business at the moment. So I have to, I can't spread myself too thin. And so, uh, I, I do, I do because of that.

Brandability and catchiness of it and just the fun factor of it. I, the reason I. I felt good about it starting, starting. It was that, you know, it, it has all these inherent built in advantages. It sort of promotes itself. It's a conversation starter. It's more catchy. I think it's my premise was that it's a little, you know, kind of more fun to wear, and those are completely, you know, competitive factors in Amazon in general.

Um, we can talk more about it on a show like this. Whereas if I sold, you know, regular t-shirts like if I did get them white labeled, uh, you know, like, uh, they'd be okay, but like not, it wouldn't be really mine. And I couldn't really build a brand on top of it here. There's all these things that are possible.

And what I really also liked about it is at its best, this business is purely automated. It's never really like that, but it's theoretically, largely automated. Can really scale. 

Joseph: [00:54:08] Yeah. I mean, there's, there's relativity here where, um, the, the energy that you use can expand outwards, exponentially. Um, so rather than having to like print each individual one, uh, which would be more of like a boutique service, this is more the ability to put that same energy in and then people can order in the hundreds.

Yeah. I print on a, on demand. Uh, I. I am so happy that that's a thing. Uh, cause uh, my girlfriend, she's a fantastic artist and we've come up with a couple of images together to, to sell and, you know, we can, we can take our time. We can just put them on red bubble on Zazzle. We can set up our own store and then just.

Let it be, and if anything happens, it happens. And if we want to push it, we can market it, but we won't necessarily have to. And the costs are so low. Yeah, it's great. It's, it's definitely something I think for people to, uh, consider some way that they can put this into their, into their brand as well. Um, I would say print on demand is something that, uh, it's an N if it can fit into a person's brand, I would definitely recommend it.

You've done quite a bit. And, um, when I'm wondering, is what are some of the, uh, accomplishments or some of the projects or works that you've done that really have stuck out to you? Um, maybe ones that we haven't talked about so far. 

Alex Genadinik: [00:55:22] Yeah. Uh, you know, I always kind of feel, and you know, this may, maybe we'll tell them like, you know, false modesty, but I really kind of feel like.

Yeah, I've done some things. Sure. But like, I think my best work is ahead of me and I'm okay with the things I've done, but I'm kind of always looking forward. So, you know, I am happy with, I guess, the courses that I have and things like that, but there's this human element that I have. Like, there's a few individuals in my coaching that I know I changed their life.

Like. There's one guy who, you know, when I started working with him, he was in a struggle period. And when I met with him on Skype calls, you had like, you know, you can see in his face, it was a, she was sad. Like things weren't working, family depended on him. It was like difficult calls. And then years later he has, I'm not even allowed to say how much money he's making, but what the goal was that he told me, I'd be happy with this amount.

I believe he's 30 or 40 times that a month. So he's his family just transformed, like, and I, and he's growing and growing. Like he's not even like his whole family is working on his business. Now his son is taking over operations and like, you know, running with it. So like, It's just like beyond life-changing.

And this is for a guy who, blue collar guy, he was cleaning, um, parts of homes as a business, and then he created a cleaner and that w and then we, I helped him sell that cleaner on Amazon and et cetera, et cetera. So just. Uh, you know, that kind of thing is what I'm really kind of actually proud about because I know from enthusi where we, we reward or we're actually the real life change that they helped to have, you know, create, um, this is not common.

It's not like I do this every day for people is, you know, that person has to participate throughout a long period of time. But that if you look back, I'm like, wow, this is the w that kind of thing is, uh, what's really. I'm proud of this actual Lake Lake. I tell this like, and I feel good about it, you know?

Um, and then there's things that, you know, took almost my entire education and career. Like, for example, I don't talk about it too much, but like the music, I, you know, I'm a, part-time very bad musician. Or let's say, you know, the right word is amateur and when you know any amateur, they don't know how bad they are, but like, they think they're great and they want people to listen.

But, uh, but I do put my heart into it in all my creative writing, all my education, you know, all my video experience and audio experience and, uh, just experience creating things, go into these songs and. I would never be able to even come close to even the level that I've gotten to. Uh, if I didn't have this like long history behind me, that was, you know, I think at the top of the show, we were like exploring our curiosities, you know, going beyond the career and gaining all these other skills.

I think the, the music that I actually create, I'm actually really proud of it because even though I've like re written books, One song that's like a beautiful, if you were to create a beautiful song, that's moving, it's infinitely harder to create than like a business book. Because a business book is kind of logical, you know, step one, step two, step three.

There's not a tremendous amount of creativity or fulfillment. You get from a book as a creative person. But if you write a song that somebody is like, wow, I just got taken to a different place for three minutes. And I'm like, wow, that's. I am for on a personal level. That for me is actually the best accomplishment.

Joseph: [00:59:09] Say this about, um, I mean, I have my own, my own musical preferences, uh, of course.

And what I noticed are some of the most significant experiences I have with music is, um, I remember I was in this art store in downtown Toronto, and I can't remember the song that came on, but the melody and the lyrics of it, it suddenly made me think about. The passage of time and how much time had passed up to that point and how much time will continue to pass.

And that eventually it runs out. And all of those thoughts all came into my head all at once. And I suddenly got like really emotional and I, well, it's an art store, so I was in safe territory, but still, yeah, I mean, music has had can, can be that, that powerful. So. No, I don't think people have that kind of emotional experience looking at a spreadsheet.

But if you do, you're welcome to be a guest on the show. I would love to hear it. And I don't mean that, uh, well, a little sarcastically, but by all means we would love to have different kinds of people on the show. 

Alex Genadinik: [01:00:06] Really different, really different in this case. 

Joseph: [01:00:07] Yeah. All right. Here's the question. I was so excited to ask because you, you, you foreshadowed chess earlier and I haven't had a chance to ask chess yet.

So cards and table I'm in bizmo chess player. I don't. I might've won a couple of games in my lifetime, but in my humble opinion, I think just as the single greatest game on the planet. Certainly the most important. Um, and speaking as like, you know, uh, I'm a, I'm an active gamer to this day and the problem is there's a lot of games these days, they undergo changes.

The development team will have to put up patches to, um, adjust the balance. Am I running theme or my running joke is that if they were to release chest today, they would have to nurse the queen. Um, now chest did have a long development phase, by the way. So things did change over time, but it's done. They figured it out.

Leave it alone. The beauty of games, and this is why it's important for people to find some way to play a game, even if it's just on their phone, is that it allows for an environment to make decisions without consequences. Um, and what that lets you do is that you actually learn about yourself. Uh, what I learned about myself in chess is I'm highly experienced, driven, um, If I know I'm going to have a really good experience that tends to supersede my desire to win.

Um, not always, but in chess it seems to come up. So when I play chess, I just turned into a bloodbath. I just try to like, get all my pieces out and I just try to hack away at everybody else. And it just, I don't know, for me, it was like a scene of Braveheart. Um, so that's what I learned about myself. But can you think of anything you learned about yourself from playing the game?

Alex Genadinik: [01:01:38] That's interesting. Uh, so you may be, um, are really attacking mindset. Right. Like, you're the Mike Tyson in your mindset. You're the Mike Tyson of all things being equal.

Joseph: [01:01:52] I I'd like to substantiate that, but oftentimes I'm more of like a defensive person. So I think because chess, I just let loose. Um, so maybe it's like defense, defense, defense, counter punch defense, defense, defense, counter punch.

Alex Genadinik: [01:02:07] So maybe it may be right. So it may, whether I think he's known as a, he would say differently about themselves, but. No. My limited knowledge is he's more of a just defensive guy, right? He, he he's counter attacking. I think he, he would probably say about himself, he's a counter attacker, but. I think he's more, I would say almost more defensive than, uh, I think the counter attacking one is one who's like, you know, lightning strikes, um, power punching.

When he goes on, when it's his turn, my Mayweather is not known for a strong punch he's okay. But he's not a power puncher, um, too much boxing in this probably, but, um, but I think, um, in my chest, I mean, I, people might not wonder where's maximum from when they're listening. So I was born in what was then Soviet union when, uh, you know, the superstars of the day.

If you think who are our biggest stars today? I dunno, Cardi B. Uh, that's the one we're in right now. They're like the biggest. Most on people. When I was growing up, it was, uh, Garry Kasparov, the chess, chess, Grandmaster. He was revered for his brain and he was the superstar of my childhood. And actually he lives in New Jersey and I live not far.

So it's my dream to meet him. And if I ever met him, I would be like, ah, But, um, that's just side note, but, um, but when I was taught to play chess, it was more like, think, think, think, think, think it's really like a patience of mind thing, because I think you see now very, very popular, the fast chess. But it's two of chest purists is, uh, antitrust because the whole premise of chess is to think, think, think when you think you have a move, keep thinking, think, and the idea is to come up with many solutions and come up with a great solutions.

Great solution. It's actually, I find that useful now, because now there's so much compulsion, right? Anytime you're bored, open your phone. As soon as you open your phone. Million news articles. All right. Now you're angry at all of them. Okay. By text it's. Um, the stimuli is coming at a such a rapid rate. And, you know, we talked earlier about emotional intelligence and waiting for, you know, the emotional part of the brain gets triggered earlier.

And the logic gets triggered a little later. The patients of mind to me, I think that gave me the chest, gave me that, you know, with my teachers, like. Literally, they told me, sit on your hands so that I couldn't just grab the pieces, you know, um, when I was a kid and, uh, I learned that, but from that, um, to your point, you know, there's this purely attacking style.

And then my style, what I kind of found also was I was a counter attacking style, but what intrigued me in the counter attacking style was that if you look at famous games, Um, there's like this moment where lightning strikes, where like, you don't see what the people are thinking yet, but when you get there, you know, like they make some move and you're like, why did they make that move?

If I move later, they're like, Oh my God, like they saw this, um, that's the. You know, whether they're counter punching or punching as a attacker, they're the Mike Tyson of it. So in chess is where your brain becomes a power puncher, uh, whether it's counter attacking or, or purely attacking, but it's, it's never, you know, defensing defenses.

Okay. There's room for that. It never was appealing to me just to be a purely positional defensive person. Um, There is a, there's a strong element of that in chess and they can win and everything. But if you look at all the grandmasters, uh, Gary Kasparov, um, Gary Fisher, super attacking like lightning strikes.

If you watch their games, it's historic, uh, superstars of chess. He, why is their games? The highlight games or it's just like lightning striking. Is there Mike Tyson's of brain. Um, that's why I really like about chess. 

Joseph: [01:06:22] That's terrific. You know, I, one of the things I find about defensive play and I know, and by the way, people, I warned you, we were going to be all over the we're going to be doing a lot of gear shifting.

Uh, so one of the things that I think is, uh, almost like a tension between the sport and the, and the audience is that. Defensive play is not entertaining. Uh, Floyd Mayweather is kind of like the big bat. People want to take them down because, uh, I think someone just personality based, but it's a lot of it just like.

They don't find them enthralling and coming from a large video game background, this, I don't expect anybody to actually go check out, but if you want to see the equivalent of this individu game world, um, there's a YouTube or by the name of, uh, ample lemon. And it does a series called never, ever, um, like there was never, ever going to be another show like Monday night raw.

There's never, ever going to be. Uh, another driver, late Dale Earnhardt, and one of them is there's never going to be another player of super smash brothers melee. I called hungry box. And in this game, everybody plays aggressive for the most part. There's a couple of people who are like floating defensive, but hungry box is like the defensive archetype and they load them there.

There was one tournament. He won, somebody throws a crab at him, uh, after he won. And he was, he was, he was so upset because, well, he did, he worked so hard and he plays so. Uh, and he plays very well, but it sounds not entertaining. And so I think defensiveness has always have been a sticking point for a lot of people.

Um, I'm, I'm the opposite. Like if I, when I'm, when I'm playing people and people are like, you're trying to get up in my face. That's when I started to get like, you know, uh, frustrated, like take a second man, breathe, you know?

Alex Genadinik: [01:07:55] Yeah. Well these scenarios, the game scenarios there, you know, in real life you have other variables.

But then, um, you can, in the games, like you said, you can really test yourself in a different environment in a good way. So like in the safe way, and you can see really where, where are you really at? You know, if you didn't have these, you know, society can trade constraints. Um, maybe you'd be like, you know, the Mike Tyson of.

You know, this is your spirit is the spirit of Mike Tyson. 

Joseph: [01:08:22] Well, I got, I'm going to, well, I'm going to two more questions for you, and then we like get you on Addie. Uh, the, the final one will always be like the traditional, uh, words of wisdom question, but, uh, this one, it's a question about creativity. It's an important subject.

And, uh, you've talked about it on your content. So from your vast instructional experience, have you ever been able to like noticeably improve someone's creative output and have you found like. Tangible ways to actually improve the creative mind or I dunno, I, I I'm, for me, creativity is like one of my strongest aspects.

And so when people ask me, like, how did I do it? I don't really know. I just kind of. Exists. Like, I just kind of do my thing. I'm being very self-congratulatory there, but if I had a technique I could share, I would, but for the most part, it's really just been like observing information, letting my mind do its thing and then spitting out results.

So I don't know. What have you come up with? Anything to help improve someone's creativity. 

Alex Genadinik: [01:09:18] People don't come to me for improving their creativity because people come to me for like, How do you start a business? How do you promote a business? Oh, sure, sure. It's straightforward things, but it is my, one of my favorite things is the personal development.

Like when people ask me, how do you become more creative? I do have ideas on them, but people, you know, for me, I think about that all the time. And uh, every once in a while, it comes up in my work with clients and things like this, but really it comes from intense focus on a problem. So. And I think there is the right balance of, like you said, that, you know, in your off time, you just, you know, some, I think you alluded to it, like some things just kind of float up, you know, like you might be taking a walk and some things and a float up, but I think there's this concept like creativity, creativity is just things that come to you, but it's really what you obsess over that you work on it all the time and work.

And not, not the Buddha image. Right. Don't sit on the tree under a tree and think, think, think that is only a part of the process. I think part of the process is intense, passionate about something intense work about something on the long-term basis. And when you get to a certain point. Um, you start to really start to think creatively in that field.

Um, like a beginner would be creative, but that's because they don't know better. They would just be all over the place. When the person gets to a little bit intermediate, this is actually an studies kind of tried to replicate this. They people saw that, um, people are at their most creative where really, you know, these unique ideas might come up and unique accidents and where people become extremely experienced in something, they get less creative because.

If you were to ask me, well, how do you promote a local business? I would have to do no original thinking. I would fall back into a pattern. Uh, how will local do this? That'll get here's your steps by, right. It's great for whoever's asking me, cause I just, I know the steps, but I don't have to think so. I'm not forced to think.

So in the intermediate level, this is where a lot of the Creek creative, creative work happens. And when you are pushed, when you need to make something better, right? Like. If cars now are fine, then they're fine. But the problem for every car manufacturer is that their competitor is getting better, so they have to get better.

And so they come up with innovations. And so there's this push for innovation. Sometimes it's necessity. That's really pushing, but sometimes it's like the intense after the necessity happens, the intense work. And then during the downtime, or like during an exercise, you know, like I go for a walk sometimes and get ideas.

I listen to music, I get some ideas. Uh, then you get ideas. So it's really the combination of the intense work and the downtime where your brain is still working in the background. You know, maybe this is not the best answer of on how to be more creative, but it's kind of my, uh, sort of best. 

Joseph: [01:12:12] Well, as a, as a self-professed, um, had creative type, there's some significant takeaways for, for there.

One of them is the relativity of fine. Like at one point in the unfolding of the car's lifespan, the, the, uh, uh, the manufacturer side, well, they've only blown up like two or three times a week. So, um, I think we're, I think we're good. I think we're good. And then somebody else comes along and says, you know, maybe we can maybe not have them get blown up at all.

Yeah. And then the other thing too, is that what you said about how, when you fall into your pattern? Um, it doesn't. Uh, call upon the creative mind. That's really important too, because what that means is in order for somebody to continue to evolve creatively, they have to continuously put themselves in a new, challenging position.

So, however good. They might think they are, they have to continue to, um, improve that. And then it speaks to the. Benefits of having a competitive mechanisms. If other people are pushing ahead, well, we don't want to fall behind. So at the very least we're, that's keeps the bottom from falling out. 

So yeah, no, the, there are some other, some valuable takeaways in there.

Alex Genadinik: [01:13:17] And sometimes it's, you know, combining fields.

So like, you know, the Dilbert cartoon, the guy came in and he was, he's very famous for saying, you know, he's not the funniest guy. He's not the best cartoonist. But you kind of combine that into a thing that, you know, he was able to make the Dilbert. So sometimes combining things in which you're pretty good, not the best.

Um, we'll kind of land you in a creative spot. Unique spot. 

Joseph: [01:13:42] Yeah. Uh, and, and the other thing too about Scott Adams is that it was based off his experience too. So he, he had had, he had come from the, uh, from the corporate world. And so we had a vast array of knowledge. And then he also said he's a trained hypnotist.

So I don't know, maybe he there's just some, some. Subtlety or some like subliminal messaging going on in his comics that compels people to read. I don't know, but if he's figured out to make it work more power to him. All right, Alex, uh, this has been a blast. Uh, we, we went to, we went over, but technically I don't actually have an over, so I don't know why I said that anyways.

We're going to get you on out of here. So our final question is. As traditional as the first one. Um, if you have any closing words of wisdom, perhaps an answer to a question I didn't ask. Uh, you're welcome to share that with us and then plug away, tell us how to reach out. What content do you want us to look into?

Um, because we, and the first chunk of this, we definitely got into your, your, your, your work as a teacher. Um, but there is. So much more to what you have to offer. So I strongly encourage listeners to, uh, pay attention to what, uh, Alex is about to tell you to go look, thank you. 

Alex Genadinik: [01:14:45] Thank you for all those kinds of words.

Um, I guess what most people do come to me for, you know, business type advice. So I guess the thing I see the most, and we can add Intel emotional intelligence into this is when people get excited about ideas, you know, Oh, I have a business idea. When I opened my Shopify store, right? This, this, this, and people get excited at first naturally.

And excitement is an emotion, has some things that are known about it. You know, it's, uh, it causes movement, right. It causes us to get started, but it also causes us. To overestimate the good that's why we're excited. We're you know, we're so it's, it's fraught with error. Um, not to say that it's it's to be enjoyed.

It's a really great emotion. We don't always have it. Um, especially in 2020 in quarantine is not a lot of excitement, but, but so it's to be enjoyed, but it's to be understood that, Hey, okay, there may be some errors here. Uh, and the great thing, like, let's say I wanted to start a restaurant like 30 years ago, you know, I'd have to spend like a hundred thousand dollars, right.

If I had to open a Shopify store, it's really inexpensive. So there's literally no risk, pretty much minimal risk negligible risk, let's say. And so the wisdom, I guess I'd say is, you know, if you were to start a restaurant or open a gym or something, it's really hard. Right. But actually. If you were to open the Shopify store, you should just do it because the next thing in emotional intelligence is the work that you'll have to do.

Let's be honest, you know, you're sitting in front in front of a computer. There's no, there's no like stadium of fans cheering you on is boring work. Right. It's kind of, it's not always fun. Online entrepreneurship behind the scenes is a little boring. So there's a lot of that. And I guess it's the long-term perseverance.

Using that excitement to push you, but the long-term perseverance to sustain you and to get you through, you know, there's always this like value Valley of despair, right? Why am I throwing up? Oh my God, why is my business not working, happens to everyone. And you know, as long as you start early persevere, long-term eventually the idea you have, which may be your Shopify store will work.

But only after those things that maybe not realize most people maybe don't realize. When they start, Hey, my excitement isn't, that's not going to stay. Excitement usually goes away on day two. There's no more excitement. There's the work. Um, and then the long-term, there's kind of just self management and just making it through all the humps, even despite everybody's saying, Oh, your store socks, or, Oh, your design is ugly or whatever.

A million things people say, they usually say they still tell me everything, you know, and everything I try to do, I get this. And I know like, people usually could say that. It's easy for them to criticize they're there. They're not even doing anything themselves, but still you hear a lot of these negative things, but you just kind of have to block it out enough to persevere beyond that.

And usually once you persevere, it's like Einstein had this quote, I think, you know, I'm not the smartest, but I'm the most persistent. Um, and that's where you start succeeding. Usually a lot later than you hope, but it does happen. So I guess that's my w words of wisdom. And, uh, what you meant, you also asked where people can reach me.

Uh, my main website is  problemio.com. Um, I, obviously my t-shirt store is a wave. If you like that com and of course my passion, the music is if people, you know, I don't have any ads on it. So people find me on YouTube. Alex Genadinik music. I really appreciate that. And comments and say hello and everything. Um, yeah, don't listen.

I also say hi so that that's where people can reach me. 

Joseph: [01:18:28] All right. Terrific. Uh, well, listeners, you, uh, you have your work cut out for you. So I, uh, I, I wanted you guys to hop to it and thank you Alex, once more for your time. And we will check in soon, take care. 

Hey listeners, Joseph here coming to you. After the interview, I asked Alex if he wanted to share one of his songs with us and he agreed, he sent us Michelangelo.

We put the full song in for you to listen to so enjoy.

Thanks for listening. You might've found this show on many number of platforms, Apple podcasts, Spotify, Google play, Stitcher, or right here on to Debutify. Whatever the case, if you enjoy this content and want to help us thrive, please take a few moments to leave a review on Apple podcasts or wherever you think is best.

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