Apple Crider: [00:00:00] For most young people, you really don't have any place to get a solid, personal financial understanding, really like learn this stuff. There's no, there's no place that you learn it unless you have parents that know this stuff. I am focused on kind of contributing to that at tide of, of just providing solid financial information to people.

Joseph: [00:00:21] You're listening to Ecomonics, a Debutify podcast. Your resource for a one of a kind of insights into the world of e-commerce and business in the modern age. This is Joseph. I'll be presenting a wealth of industry knowledge from interviews with successful business people and our own state-of-the-art research. Your time is valuable, so let's go.

Apple Crider is a welcome sign that our upcoming generation are among some of the most informed. In the online age, Apple has learned how to take command of his future, using the tools at all of our disposal. Even if you don't have a business yet, and we're just passing through, there's some actionable information here that anyone with a vested interest in their own money can put into practice.

Apple Crider, it's good to have you here. Thank you for being on Ecomonics. How's it going? How are you doing man?

Apple Crider: [00:01:14] I'm doing well. It's a pleasure to be speaking with you. How are you? 

Joseph: [00:01:17] I'm doing pretty good. I haven't had any power surges in less than a while. I'm a very transparent guy and I revealed on like in a previous episode that we had to like, start it over and so my anxiety is slowly starting to dissipate, uh, because in those episodes where we had those surges, they would like, every time they would pause to think I'd be like, "Oh my God, I freakin lost them again". But to, yeah, I'm feeling I'm feeling good. Uh, glad to have you here. I was also glad to do, um, do some research on you. You, as, as I was learning about you, in order to be prepared for this interview, you opened up my eyes and I'm looking forward to opening up the eyes of our audience today. Um, but first question, warm you up to our audience and warm the audience up to you is who you are and what you do. 

Apple Crider: [00:01:58] Yeah, great question. So my name's Apple, I am 21 years old and essentially I'm a pretty big personal finance nerd. I've been into personal finance, investing, credit cards, all that good stuff ever since a very young age. And so I've just kind of been continuing to pursue that in kind of different forms throughout the last couple of years. So, graduated from college with a personal finance degree, sat for the certified financial planner exam, which is kind of like the premiere exam for people that, that help people with money. So, did that a couple months ago and now I'm really focused on investing in my brand online, building my YouTube channel on my podcast up, and then eventually turning that into a wealth management firm for specifically online entrepreneurs, because that's who I love talking to and helping them with money is what I love. So, that is the vision. 

Joseph: [00:02:44] And we don't want to like. Yeah, we're going to, we're going to talk about some, some age, uh, uh, disparity going on here. Uh, for one, there is a, there's a ten-year gap between you and me and I'm and I'm wigging out because I'm just entering into my thirties and I don't really know how to like relate them to my twenties, but it's, it's, it's, it's inspiring to see how well you put your foundation together at this point.

Um, so the first part of this I don't want to talk about, this is the overarching theme, is the disconnect between finance and the young. Uh, like I said, I'm 31 years old now and I have an overall grasp my finances. I've got my, um, savings. Got, uh, putting money away, put it into here or there. Uh, so I'm doing, I, um, I, I had a bank account when I was a kid. I won it in a game of bingo. Um, yeah, it was cool. We had, we had bingos. I won it in the transformer. I got, I got savings account. Um, I did not understand how a savings account works until I was 25 years old. Until then, I thought the whole point of a savings account was it just put your money in a vault so you don't get robbed versus putting it under the bed. I didn't know what interest was. Um, I didn't know about the relation between savings and taxes and, uh, and, and written retirement themes. And man, do I wish I knew this stuff sooner. So what's being done by you and, you know, in your circles to improve financial knowledge for coming generations. 

Apple Crider: [00:04:13] Yeah. That's I mean, that's, those are all very important points that you brought up. And I think that, uh, for most people, for most young people, you really don't have any place to get a solid, personal financial understanding and really like learn this stuff. There's no, there's no place that you learn it unless you have parents that know this stuff. Um, but, but most people habits they're getting from their parents aren't all that great if they're getting any. Most parents just don't even want to talk about this stuff. It's kind of taboo. So, most people come in with, with absolutely nothing and then they get thrown into either college or the real world. And they're like, I have no idea what to do, like I'm getting this money now. I don't know what to do with it. How do I save it? How do I prepare for the future? And so there, there was really not a lot going on in the space of educating people other than these, these sales people, essentially that were calling themselves financial advisors, trying to sell you life insurance. So, uh, I, I really, um, and then now there's this, this community of people online, whether it's bloggers, YouTubers, podcasters, that are kind of filling in this gap and giving young people this financial, um, basis to go off of. And, and kind of prepare people to, to make wise financial decisions. So I am focused on kind of contributing to that, that tide of, of just providing solid financial information to people that, that they're not going to learn in school. They're not going to learn from their parents unless they're in the upper echelons of society anyway. So, so my focus is on providing that to people who actively seek it, because one thing about learning stuff online is like, you have to actively seek this stuff out, which is, which is still a pretty big con in my view. Like there is no, there's no way for just society as a whole to learn this stuff without actively seeking it out. So, for now I'm only providing content to people that choose to seek it out. But, over time, hopefully I'm able to make a bigger difference in kind of impacting people even the ones that aren't actively thinking about this stuff.

Joseph: [00:06:00] There's a couple of points that I want to raise too, and one of them is about the, and again, this is going to come back to a disconnect between, um, uh, people in, in, in these age brackets and finances. And I remember being, uh, what was I 23, 24 when there was the occupy wall street movement and I remember I paid a visit to it. Um, there was an open mic there. That was a mistake. And, and I think it's not just about not really understanding how it works, but I think there's also a lot of reluctance and a lot of resentment towards the financial system, because I think a lot of people are, are in this belief that, you know, the system is out to get us, or it's not, it's not on our side. And, um, I, you know, at your point, how did you, uh, how did you reconcile with that? How did you manage the capacity or is there, is there any truth or any credence to it? 

Apple Crider: [00:06:48] Yeah, no, I think there's definitely a lot of truth to that. And I mean, you really have to think about like all of these, these big companies, these banks, they're, they're driven by financials. Like their shareholders want to see returns and their CEOs want to get paid and they want their stock options to go up in value. So, like their incentive is to make more money. And so you, you kind of have to think about that. In any interaction that you're going into with any company, with any individual, you have to think about where their incentives are out. So, when you're going into these, these relationships with banks, like you have to realize like their business model is to turn you into dollar signs. So you have to, you have to keep that stuff in mind, but at the same time, there's this balance between, you have to make smart financial decisions for yourself and then you have to balance your, your social conscience of like, am I just feeding this machine? That's just like tearing society apart. So like it's tough. And like there's no, I mean, there's no right answer you know? Like it really comes down to each individual. Like what kind of things are you willing to support? But, I think realizing that we do get to like vote with our dollars per se and like really decide like, okay, I'm putting my money with this institution. I might get a lower return on that money, but at the same time, it's for a cause that I support. So, as investors, as individuals, we have to think about these and make these decisions and, and sometimes it's, it's, it's a balance between the economics of it and just your, your conscience and your, like your, your, like how important these, these issues are to you. 

Joseph: [00:08:10] And I've touched on this theme before about, um, you know, greed and ethics and trying to, uh, be compassionate hero in dark times. And it's not just money. Uh, it really happens all over. It's the idea of buying an iPhone, knowing the manufacturing that goes into it. It's no secret. Everybody knows it. And plenty of people buy it. I mean, I don't have an iPhone. I have a Samsung, but I don't think the Samsung manufacturing is that far off. Um, eating meat is, uh, we know, we know what happens when, uh, when animals go through this. Even, and this is coming from somebody who I've done a background acting in the past, and I don't want to throw any particular studio under the bus, but sometimes background actors or actor, actors, they get put through the ringer in order to produce content. And so, there is a lot of suffering in the world. And so, getting over that is something that you had to do, because what I think happens is. People and youngsters, especially, you know, we're, we have got a lot of cynicism. I know, I remember how cynical I was when I was 13, 17, and so on is we have to be careful not to use that as an excuse, not to take action. And I'll just still try to contribute to the net good. In any way, because if we don't do anything, then yes, the system does get worse. But if we can create a net good, then yeah, we can actually do something because, and even in a cosmic sense, even in a positive negative sense, there is negative energy in the world and we have to harness that in order to wash that over with more positivity. 

Apple Crider: [00:09:32] Yeah, I totally agree. And I think just like having, like having the information is, is in my opinion, always going to make you better off, like it's never going to make you worse off to know more about the situation I think. And so if, if I can provide this information to people and they can choose to do what they want with it, like I'm not trying to tell people how to live their lives, but at the same time, it's like, if you understand how this system works and kind of the options you have available to you, then you can make an educated decision. Whereas if you don't have this information, you're just kind of going in blind. You don't really know. Like, is this a good decision? Is this a bad decision? What is this influencing? So that's, that's kinda where I'm aiming to, to kind of fit in. 

Joseph: [00:10:06] So, um, one of the things that you touched on earlier on is that for now a lot of this is people are seeking you out and you don't, you're not really getting the opportunity to reach out to them. Have you, do you have any plans, any blueprints as to how you want to maybe get, to make your way into the Twitch crowd or anything that you want to do with your brand to try to make your way into that? Cause you'd have a lot of advantages. I think you do have a lot of that, that, that youth appeal. And I'd like to see you pull it off.

Apple Crider: [00:10:32] Yeah. Well, I mean, I've, I've thought about getting more involved with tiktok because that's where a lot of, a lot of young people are that, and there are some like financial influencers in the tiktok space, which I, that are doing really, really well for themselves. So I think there's a lot of potential there to reach a whole new audience of people that wouldn't ordinarily go on YouTube and typing. Like, how do I improve my credit score? You know, because that's like the crowd that I'm catering to right now is those types of people. But on tiktok, you're just kind of scrolling through your feed and like, oh, maybe you get a, a video about how to set up a savings account. And you're like, oh, this is actually kind of something I've been thinking about. So that's, that's probably the next move for me, uh, to just start getting in front of a different crowd of people. I, I don't know much about, uh, like twitch live streaming and whatnot. So I think tiktok is probably the next logical next logical step. 

Joseph: [00:11:16] That makes sense. I mean, one idea that just popped into my head and I consider it a pitch that you're free to throw in the trash, but I think always starting with the results is probably the best way to appeal to somebody. So do you, do you want to retire at this age? Do you want to live this lifestyle? Do you want to take care of yourself in the future? I think if you, if you start with the results in the same way, some stories, they start with like the climactic moment and then free freeze frame. I bet you're wondering how we got to this point. And then it goes back to the beginning and then, you know, okay, well I know where this is going, but now I'm invested in the journey. 

Apple Crider: [00:11:46] Yeah, no, I, I totally agree. And I think, I think a lot of times, like that gets played too far in the, like the, the personal finance and entrepreneurship space, because there's a lot of people trying to sell pipe dreams out there. And I think that's, I think that's where a lot of people get a sour taste in their mouth. If they don't have a lot of experience or exposure to the whole personal finance space and then they get some of these like ads thrown at them on social media, they click through, they ended up spending a couple hundred bucks on this thing and it turns out to be a complete scam. And so like that, that kind of stuff really puts a sour taste in my mouth. So I think there's a lot of that going on. And so it's, it's, it's. It's always a balancing act to try to stay away from that, but still get people's attention. 

Joseph: [00:12:23] Yeah. Well you should, you should I have, I have my personal YouTube account and then I have a YouTube account for all of the different, um, uh, e-commerce uh, people that I've researched. You should see my algorithm whenever I go to ad it's always people are getting out of their Ferrari's left right and center. 

Apple Crider: [00:12:39] Yeah. 

Joseph: [00:12:39] All right. So, I do want to know a little bit about, uh, about your background because, I just want to know, like what drew you into financial study in the first place? You know, how did you know early on how financials would impact your life? Like where was that kernel of curiosity? 

Apple Crider: [00:12:53] Yeah. No, that's a great question. So I'm not exactly sure. Like I've, I've been thinking about this a lot and for me, I mean, I know it started when I was probably about eight years old. I would be very conscious of how my parents interacted with money. Both in how they used it, but then also how they talked about it and how they just communicated around money. So, uh, whether, whether my mom and I were at the store and she would remark that something was cheap or expensive or not worth it. And like these things really stuck with me and really got me thinking like, well, well, how does money play a role in my life? And like, How, how do I control it? How does it control me? And like the, these questions kind of just started turning the ball. And then like, with my peers, once, once we started making some spending money, like how my peers interact with money and how I would interact with money and just like the, those things just kind of really, really, really captivated me. And then at about 12 years old, I got my first job. My uncle owns a campground. And so I would work there in the summers, um, basically just sit behind the cash register and stuff. And, and so that really, once I had like an income stream and I was making money, like that started a whole nother train of thought. So ,all of that kind of conspired to me getting to college and deciding like, I want to study this and I want to really learn about how to help people with money stuff, because like, it, it was clear to me very early on that like money plays a very integral part of our lives, whether we want to admit it or not, like some people will, will very strongly deny the fact that money plays any kind of role in their life. But, but in reality, like whether we like to admit it or not, like there is a role that money is going to play in our lives. And if we have more knowledge about how to effectively use money and how to, how to just like, make it work for us rather than us working for it, like, I think that's a good thing in the world as a net, as a whole. So, I realized that. And then from there, uh, went to school, started studying finance and, um, sort of my YouTube channel as well, where I would just like make videos about the stuff that I was doing so like whenever I got a new credit card, I would make a video about it. When I made a new investment, I would make a video about it and just kind of to share with people like, yo, this is what I'm doing, um, feel free to like, do something similar if you want to, or if you think this is a terrible idea, let me know. And so it was just a way for me to kind of have a creative outlet, but at the same time, just talk about stuff that I really cared about and share this information with other young people that weren't necessarily getting it elsewhere. So that's, I mean, that's kind of where it started. It was really just in my tendency to observe which I really have a very strong tendency to, to observe things and people and how the world works around me. So it all really stemmed from that. 

Joseph: [00:15:21] Yeah, I, hearing your story. It just reminded me, like, what are some of the imprints that money had on me when I, when I was a kid and one of the ones that stuck out to me is, um, you know, I was a big fan of a toy story growing up. And, uh, the toy story pc game came out and I wanted, and I had money from like, my communion or something. And I remember this was the first time I understood what taxes were, but I understand it in a very rudimentary sense where the game was like, I don't know, 50 bucks. And I have some bucks on me. And so I buy it and I give him the 50. He says, oh no, no, it's not enough. You have to give, you have to give the other money. Wait, wait a minute. I have to give more money. And then, uh, and then the other part that imprinted on me too, and I don't remember this any specific, I don't remember the exact specific moment that's happened, but I think every kid at some point asks, you know, why, why can't we just, you know, make the money ourselves and, you know, and the, and the parent always says, well, you know, you can't just print money like that. That's not how it works. And now as a, uh, as much where wisdom that I am. That is exactly how it works now that we've moved on to Fiat currency. Okay. That is all we do with printing money. If you've seen the deficit here, once upon a time, we got the gold standard. We're not doing that anymore. 

Apple Crider: [00:16:30] No, no. You're not allowed to print money, but somebody is. 

Joseph: [00:16:34] Yeah, exactly. All right. Um, okay. What, what question I, is this an intrigue? Um, So, you know, when, when, when are a lot of, we have a lot drop shipping, uh, experts and, and they teach their, uh, their peoples how to do it. And they get to see the results pretty right away. Or like, hey, you know, in three months I was able to pull this off and, and, and, and happy times were made. Um, but I'm wondering about what kind of feedback you've managed to get so far, because. These are the returns or you're not really going to be able to see for, for quite a while.

Apple Crider: [00:17:08] Yeah. Yeah. Well, like in terms of helping people or?

Joseph: [00:17:11] Yeah, yeah. 

Apple Crider: [00:17:13] Yeah. So in terms, I mean, there's, there's a lot of different areas that I talk about, um, including like credit cards and saving money and investing money and entrepreneurship and all that stuff. And like with investing in the stock market, like, yes, that's, that's a relatively long-term endeavor, you know, like, the, the type of investing that I do is not like it's not day trading. You're not like moving in and out of stuff and making a billion dollars every day. You know, it's like, it's like long-term stuff. So like with, with the investing side of things, like, yes, like the returns from that are going to be like, it's going to make a huge difference on people's life, but, but it's going to take a long time, you know, like if you start when you're 20, by the time you're 50, like it's going to be crazy how much of a difference just, just starting off at 20 will make for you. Uh, but obviously like the people who are consuming my content haven't turned 50 yet. And, and so like that has yet to play out. But in other respects, like with credit cards, I mean, that's the kind of the time span on that is a lot shorter. So like, you can get some crazy results with credit cards, a lot shorter. So, like people, people that I've referred credit cards to you have gone on trips and like, not really so much right now, but like before the whole world shut down, um, being able to see people like, I, I would help them out with credit cards and like, like even just my parents, for example, like my parents have signed up for like so many credit cards off of my recommendations, and then they're getting free travel left, right and center, you know? So it's like, it's, it's, there are cool results that you can see and like, um, yeah, I mean, really, really with credit cards is where a lot of the, a lot of the results have, have come from that I've, I've heard about at least, but, um, yeah. It's with the investing, it's definitely a lot longer of a time horizon.

Joseph: [00:18:45] Okay. Well, that's good. That's a good, uh, that's a good point though, because you can see short returns on, on a credit card, which is, is an investment in of itself. And this was, um, this was the next question that I had chambered for you. Like, um, one of my friends, he's a major stickler and he loves, get you like accumulating different credit cards, any, any, ever, every time he has a purchase, it's like, it's like a game of poker where he'll he'll you can pull out like five different cards and figure out which, which play he wants to make. Um, so, so this question is for my boy, Josh is, um, tell us about the value you have been able to extract from credit cards and you mentioned it so far, so you already kind of like semi answered the question, but I'd love to hear more about this. 

Apple Crider: [00:19:21] Yeah, no, I, I love talking about this stuff. So I'll, I'll talk all day long, but I mean, for me credit card, there's like, there's the short-term benefits and there's the long-term benefits and the long-term benefits in mind, you were like way, way, way, way, way higher than, than the short your benefits. But the short-term benefits are a lot more like flashy and cool and fun. So we'll start with the short term. So, short term it's it's free travel. So, I've accumulated somewhere between five and $10,000 with the free travel from credit cards in the last like two years, which is like kind of bananas, you know, like to just be able to pick up and like go wherever I want. Like, I went to Southeast Asia for like two, three months at the beginning of 2020, and that was off free travel. I spent like $20 on my plane ticket maybe, um, and the rest was all points. And then, I didn't really spend much money while I was there because I just had points to spend on everything. So like, it's, uh, it's crazy when you start accumulating these credit card points and it's dangerous too. So I, I like to kind of preface anytime I talk about credit cards by just like letting people know, like it's really easy to get messed up with credit cards. Like the average American carries six grand in credit card debt at like a 20% interest rate. That's like hundreds of dollars a year. That's going straight to the bank. Uh, just for the privilege of buying your iPhone early, you know? So like if, if you're using credit cards in that respect, I would, I would formally advise you to go check out Dave Ramsey, he'll tell you all about where credit cards are evil and why you should cut them up? So, um, if that's the camp you're in, I wouldn't mess with credit cards, but if you are in a place where you have money to meet your basic everyday expenses, and you were looking for a way to start getting some free travel from the money that you're already spending, that's where I think credit cards can come into play. And I think you have to be very responsible with these things, because if you carry a balance on them, if you don't pay them off in full every single month, that's when the banks win you know. But, if you pay them off in full every single month, that's when you can win, because that's when you can start accumulating these, these points and these miles and travel places for free. So, that's the short term side of things. It's like, you get the cards, you put your normal spending on them, you pay them off and you accumulate thousands of dollars in free travel. So that's the short-term. Long-term though, that's that's where like the, you get the most bang for your buck. And like when I'm thinking about long-term, it's about building your credit score and then using your credit score to do cool things. So in the future, I definitely want to buy property and own real estate, whether it's like a house for myself or, or maybe it's a multi-family unit, or maybe it's whatever, some, some kind of real estate, you know, like it's, it's, uh, it's something that I want to do with my life. And so when you have a higher credit score, you get a lower interest rate on your loans. And the average American pays about $280,000 in mortgage interest throughout their life, which is a crazy number. Like most people here, 200 that's over a quarter million dollars that you're paying just to the bank, just for the privilege of borrowing money to buy a piece of property, which is probably going to be your primary residence. So that's, that's absolutely mind boggling. And so having a higher credit score will lower your interest rate and dramatically lower that $280,000 does something that, that might sound a lot more reasonable. So, that's, that's kind of the big benefit that I see and that's how building your credit early on can save you like over a hundred grand throughout the course of your life, which is crazy, you know, like a hundred grand that's that that's a lot of money for a lot of people. So, if you can, if you could really establish that credit early on that, that's, we're going to see the most bang for your buck, especially if you do want to buy real estate or borrow money from people like, like having a high credit score is a very important thing. And so if you can start that early on, because a lot of, a lot of having a good credit score is starting early on and just like having a solid history for years and years and years. And so, I mean, the earlier you start the earlier you get that history built up. So that's, that's the main thing that I would say. And like, I think most people would do well to just sign up for a very small credit card, you know, just apply from one from your local credit union, your local bank, whatever, um, put like your groceries on it every single month, pay it off in full and just start building up that credit score, you know. Because, over time, it's going to be very useful to you, even if you don't really need it right now and you're going to thank yourself for it probably in the long run, but if you're getting into debt, then that I would say, get rid of the credit card, chop it up, get rid of it and just don't even mess with it. 

Joseph: [00:23:19] Yeah, exactly. So the, so this is great because it touches on, you know, the, the purpose of credit in the first place. And, you know, we, we, we, we opined earlier about the, uh, about fiat currency and deficit. Um, so you raised a lot of, a lot of good points there and my personal interpretation of, of credit and you know, even the name of the deficit, which we talked about earlier is that it's all a trust-based system is the premium is I know I'm going to pay this off, but I want it. Or in some people's cases, they need it sooner. And, and that's how I've always managed to like, to make peace with the, um, with, with fiat currency and the way it spends, because if that currency is, well, it was just as like a, it's an energy based thing and people put an energy into the economy and it motivates people to continue. Bitcoin is the same thing. People can check out my Bitcoin episode from earlier. And so the federal government, and it's not just us, by the way, any fee backed currency, does this is it continues to take a loan out on his future productivity because it knows that it is going to be able to do that and maybe their fingers are crossed behind their back that they're going to invent some sort of quantum energy technology that'll allow them to just kind of like search past all of this. So in, in a bizarre way, I'm just like, you know what? Just write off the debt. I don't care anymore. I just. Just do it. Um, but me I'm pro credit cards. I signed up for my first credit card because I wanted to subscribe to world of Warcraft, no other way to say no other way to get onto that, that fricking game or, you know, I could have bought the time cards, but it's okay. I just wanted to, I just wanted to get the credit card. And yeah, and I, and I've been using it ever since. And, and I have a points based system. Uh, I put all my transactions onto the one card. I get my points and then I'm accumulate. I'm, I'm building up a credit for, uh, for great Wolf lodge, which for those of you who don't know is a, is a, is a getaway slash water park just to go on like a vacation cause I love water parks. Um, but I am blown away at how much return you got out of your credit card in order to travel because travel, travel ain't cheap. Um, so like what was the, what was the transactional history? Like, did you, did you buy a tank? Like how did you manage to, to, to, to, to, uh, to afford that based on what I would assume is a fairly responsible, um, spending pattern of yours.

Apple Crider: [00:25:24] Yeah. So no heavy machinery required. Um, really just my everyday, maybe just for fun, but yeah. So, basically my, how I use credit cards is, at the moment, I think I have about 12, maybe 13, going to be applying for another one either later today or tomorrow. And so essentially my view with credit cards is I'm putting my everyday spending on them. And for a time about a year, I was running a business that had a fair number of expenses. So I could fund a lot of those expenses on the credit cards, which is great. Because it's more points. Um, but even without doing that, I still would've accumulated at least like five grand in free travel. And so that's mostly because of the cards that I choose to apply for. So my whole mo with credit cards is so, so most good credit cards are going to have something called a signup bonus, where basically, if you spend a certain amount of money in the first 90 days, they're going to give you a whole big old bag full of points. And so if you can maximize on those, that's where the most bang for your buck is going to be. Because other than that, it's like you're in 2% here, 3% there and like that, that adds up over time. But like, that's nothing compared to like getting a huge batch of like 50,000 points, which is worth like 500 bucks potentially. So, that's that's where you gonna get the most bang for your buck. And so what I'll do is I'll scope out different credit cards. I'll figure it out. Okay. On an average month, how much am I spending? Okay. And say it's for, for example, like say it's a thousand bucks. Okay. So saying the average ones is spending a thousand bucks. I'm going to look for credit cards with signup bonuses of $3,000 in 90 days or lower because those ones I know I can meet with my normal spending. And so I'll find these credit cards, I'll meet the sign up bonuses, I'll get the bonus and then I'll get the next one and then I'll get the next one, then I'll get the next one. And so I'm just continuously getting these signup bonuses and not having to change my spending and maybe sometimes I know I'll have a big expense coming up and then I can get a, a one with a higher signup bonus because I know that, Oh, I'll just loop in that a thousand dollar expense that I need to buy whatever. And then this month, and then I'll go for like a $4,000 one. So like that's, that's my strategy. That's my mo. And really once, once I get to sign a bonus, like I don't even have to use the thing anymore. You know, I can just put it in my, in my sock drawer. I've got like a collection of these credit cards at this point that I no longer use because the benefit was in the sign-up bonus. And so, I'll either just like, hold on to it. If there's no annual fee, most of the cards that I have, don't have an annual fee. If it does have an annual fee, something like that, not a lot of people know is that you can actually downgrade that card to a free card in most cases. So most cards kind of exist on this continuum of like a no fee card and like medium and then like high. And so you can kind of upgrade and downgrade throughout these, these tiers with, with, if you're working with a big bank like us bank or chase or American express, they've got cards all along these tiers. And so if you have a card that has a fee, you got the sign up bonus you no longer want the card. You can call them up and then downgrade that card to a free card and then just hold on to it. Because when you cancel a credit card, that's actually really bad for your credit score. So we want to make sure that you just hold onto these things long-term,even if you don't use them, they're still working hard for you to build your credit score. So that's my mo and that's how you can kind of accumulate a lot of points fairly quickly without having to spend, uh, bazillions of dollars on, on credit cards.

Joseph: [00:28:22] Okay. So. Is it just one, one thing that I wanted to, uh, uh, uh, to address about that is there really isn't it. Canceling it, yeah. I can see that being bad for your credit. Downgrading, it makes sense. In fact, that's what I did cause I had a gold, uh, credit card and it did, and it did give me a sign up bonus, which, uh, booked my first night at great Wolf lodge and then I switched it down to a silver, which was no monthly fees and that's what I do all my transactions on. Um, and so holding onto all these cards, but not seeing any activity on it, there's no effect there on your, on your credit score, even if you're not using it?

Apple Crider: [00:28:53] No. It's all positive effect actually, because when you have a credit card that you don't put a payment on for a month, the bank is still reporting to the credit bureaus and on-time payment and 0% utilization on the card, which are both going to positively impact your score. So even just hold on, holding on to something with no spend is going to positively impact you. The only thing you'll have to watch out for, is sometimes credit card companies will go through and they'll just kind of be like, okay, who hasn't been using their card in a long time, and they'll just cancel these things. Usually they're going to send you a heads up before they do that. They'll send you something in the mail and be like, hey, haven't used this card in a while. Do you still want it? Or should we just cancel it? But I generally recommend like at least once a year, just like buy a sticker gum or a pack of gum or whatever on, on credit cards you want to keep around because if the bank does just shut them down, um, that's going to be bad. Cause it's basically, it is getting cancelled and so that's going to be bad for your score, but as long as you just have this thing, you may buy something once a year on it. It's going to positively impact your score overall. 

Joseph: [00:29:46] Yeah, I could see maybe if I just put my Quip subscription onto like one card, just so that it's it's 20 bucks a month. It's just going and I'm I transfer my, my money from my checking into my, uh, into my savings or in my credit card anyways. Cool. Well, that's a lot of really good stuff so far. Uh, Josh, you're welcome. 

So the next one that I want to ask you about too, is, um, is retirement and Roth IRA. Now I live in Canada and this is a global audience. So I don't think I have access to this specific service of Roth IRA. Um, but I still want to know about it and like what's the breakdown for people around the world. So they know what they can look for in their respective States. 

Apple Crider: [00:30:21] So, so yeah, so Roth IRA is big, big deal, especially people in the U S if you're international, there's going to be different options available to you. But, but yeah, it's going to be probably something similar depending on what country you're in. I know in Canada, um, I think you guys have got like TFSA's and RRSP's. I think those are like, kind of the equivalent to Roth IRAs, but essentially, a Roth IR is a type of retirement account where you can get tax benefits for saving for retirement because the government, at least in the U S doesn't really want to foot your retirement bill, you know, they've got social security who knows where that's going to be, but in the grand scheme of things, like they don't want to be responsible for paying for your life from age 60 to age death. So they want you to be responsible for, for, for doing that. And so what they're gonna do is they're gonna say, Hey, If you do this for us, we're going to give you some tax benefits and not uncle Sam is not going to take as much of your money in the form of taxes. So basically how this thing works is so there's two kinds of, of IRAs. Basically, there's a Roth IRA and a traditional IRA. And the, the difference here is when the money is taxed, because they're still going to be taxed, but, not as much. So with a Roth IRA, what's going to happen here is you're going to get money from your job and you're going to pay taxes on that. Um, your employer is just going to take the taxes out and then you're gonna pay taxes every year, you know, normal taxes. But, then you're going to take that money that you already pay taxes on. You're going to put that in the Roth IRA. You're going to, take that money. It's now in this account. You're going to invest it into things like stocks or mutual funds or whatever. You're gonna buy this stuff in this account. And then your money is hopefully going to grow over time to the point where you retire and say, you've invested a hundred thousand dollars into this account over the course of your working career. It's grown to a million and now you've got $900,000 of gains over the past four years and normally $900,000 worth of gains that will be taxed anywhere from 15 to 20%, which is going to be anywhere from like 150 grand to like 200 grand. So that's, that's a lot of money in taxes, you know, like you get to retirement, you think you've got a million bucks, but in reality, you've only got 800,000, which again, 800,000 still seems like a lot of money, but it's not quite as much as a million. So with a Roth IRA, you're going to have that, a million at retirement and you're going to pay zero taxes on it. Okay. So there's no tax you're taking away that 150 grand, 200 grand in taxes and you're paying nothing. Okay. But that's only if you leave the money in the account until you retire. And in US, they set the retirement age at 59 and a half for who knows why, but once you turn 59 and a half, then you basically have access to this money. And there's, there's also some additional ways you can get access to it, whether you, uh, become disabled, you'll have access to the money, or there's a couple other ways to qualify for this, but a really important thing to keep in mind with Roth IRA, big misconception a lot of people have is that once you put money into the account, it's locked away and that's not the case. Okay. You put money in the account. You can always take back the money that you put in. So if you put in a thousand dollars and it grows to 2000, you can take that first thousand dollars back whenever you want. If you try to dip into the second thousand dollars, that's when you're going to start getting hit with taxes and penalties. Okay. So you really don't want to do that, but in an emergency, if you do have to take money out of this thing, you can absolutely do so tax and penalty free if you're only taking out what you put in. So that's, that's Roth IRAs in a nutshell. And, and really the, the reason that I am like so fired up about them is like, yeah, there's, there's so much potential for younger individuals to really set themselves up, to have a productive and good financial life by just taking a couple of small actions early on and one of which is, is setting up a Roth IRA and just funneling in like, I mean like 10% of your income would be amazed. You could put 10% of your money away, every single paycheck into this Roth IRA. Like you're going to be so sad by the time that you want to retire, that you're not even gonna have to worry about this stuff, you know, but, it's it's, it's really just like your, your, your ingredients for investing our time and money. And so if you can maximize the amount of time that you're doing this, you don't have to put as much money away and you can live. You can spend a lot more of your money today, if you put a little bit of it away for tomorrow. So, I mean, my whole philosophy around money is like maximize today while still thinking a little bit about tomorrow, but like still like today is the moment and the moment is now, like, you gotta, you gotta optimize for that. But at the same time, if you don't think at all about the future, then eventually that's going to catch up to you. Uh, so, so that's, I mean, that's, that's Roth IRAs in a nutshell. 

Joseph: [00:34:31] That's great. So one thing that, uh, that came up while I was, uh, what was listening to this is, um, and I just want to clarify, because maybe I just didn't understand it. Um, so with putting money into the Roth IRA, uh, now is that money, is the bank using that money to make specific investments? Like, are they investing in good point? 

Apple Crider: [00:34:51] Good point. So, yeah, I didn't, I wasn't very clear about that. So essentially a Roth IRA is very similar to like a normal bank account, you know, where you're putting money into this account. But the difference is once you put money into the account, then you get to choose where to invest it. And so the banks not investing this money, you are, you're getting to invest this money and decide where it goes. So you can use it to buy stocks of Amazon or Apple, or just buy, um, funds that contain the entire stock market and like, you can do whatever you want with this money. You can even use it to buy real estate. You know, like you can buy anything you want with the money in this account basically. And so you do that. And then, and then it grows over time and then you're able to use that for retirement. 

Joseph: [00:35:25] Okay. And then if you, if you're not really sure about this kind of thing, do you, I assume that the advisors can, can guide people and help them figure out where they want to put it.

Apple Crider: [00:35:33] Yeah, absolutely. I would always recommend talking to, to do some kind of professional, but one thing that I'm learning more and more as I become certified and really like get deeper into the whole financial services field is there's a lot of people out there, uh, trying to sell you a lot of things that you don't need. So I would just be very, always, always ask a lot of questions. If you don't understand what somebody is telling you, ask them to clarify, like you are their client. It is, is your money on the line. It's your, uh, it's your right to know what this person is trying to get you to do. So, uh, ask lots of questions and really just establish early on with this person's business model is. Are they a sales person? Are they calling themselves an advisor? But in reality, they're a salesperson because if they are, you want to know that it doesn't mean you. You can't work with them, but it does mean like, just know where their incentives are at and how they're getting paid, because that's probably going to influence how they make decisions. So there's a lot of stuff to keep in mind there and in general, I mean, if you're working with someone who is a CFP or certified financial planner, that's like the top of the top and like maybe a little bit biased because I just took that exam. But if you're working with somebody like they're legally obligated to work in your best interest, they are not, like they cannot like subvert your interest for their own. They are legally bound to put you ahead of them. And so that's, I mean, that's the only destination for, for financial planners and financial advisors that actually requires that level of care. So, um, if you want to know that someone's putting you first, definitely CFE is the way to go.

Joseph: [00:36:56] That's great. Yeah. I just wrote that note down and then I underlined it a bunch of times just, just to make sure. All right. So this question popped up as I was, um, as I was listening to your breakdown and full disclosure, this is very tongue in cheek, but is there an age where it's too late, where like somebody is going to be screwed over and they're not going to be able to make this, uh, this IRA worked for them?

Apple Crider: [00:37:19] It's a good question. And I would, I would say that it's never too late. It just becomes more and more difficult the longer you wait. So, like I said, like, if you can put 10% of your income away in your twenties, like that's going to, like, you can just do 10% from your twenties till like 60 or whenever you wanna retire and like, you'll be good, roughly, like I'm not, this is not financial advice. Like I'm not saying like there's a hundred percent guaranteed, but like roughly, but if you start 10 years later, say you're probably going to have to save a little bit more every single year. You start 10 years later, you're going to save a lot more. If you, if you notice it until you're 40, like that's when you're really going to have a rough time, we're gonna have to save a lot of money every single year. You're gonna have to really cut back on your lifestyle just in order to optimize for your future years. So like the earlier you start, like, again, your ingredients are time and money, so the more time you put in the less money you got to put in, but the longer you wait, the more you're probably going to have to, to invest in the more you're going to have to kind of change your current lifestyle and maybe reduce things in order to meet those future obligations.

Joseph: [00:38:12] Well, I have one stipulation to that. Uh, and this is hypothetical, but ideally, um, between twenties to thirties, thirties to forties is that somebody's earning power would increase because their skill set increases and they get higher paying jobs. So, and for the record, like I said, like I have some money put away, but I have not put money into an a, in Canada. Yes, it is an RRSP. You're correct about that. I do have a TFSA though. So. And also not that, not that I can give any advice, but it's just in case people are curious. I use a TFS as my emergency fund because I can pull it out right away and I do generate interest on it. So just in case I get into any legal troubles or needed a root canal, I just dip into my TFS. It alleviates some, but not all of my anxiety, but what, where is the, um, the trade off between somebody in their thirties who hypothetically counting myself can actually earn more money than they were earning in their twenties anyways. 

Apple Crider: [00:39:05] Yeah. I mean, I think that's a good point. Like yeah. Hopefully over time, your income is, is going up, but in the grand scheme of things, like if you can just, I mean, there's this whole like saying that you should like pay yourself first. And I think there's, there's a lot of truth to that in, in that if you can just kind of like skim this amount off the top before you even like, look at it, like set up like auto deposits to your, I don't even remember what it's called at this point, our RSP or something. Um, just like set up auto deposits to just skim off the top, go right in there. Like that's, uh, as, as your income grows, like those deposits will get bigger and your income still going up, but, but you're still saving for retirement. So like, that's, I mean, that's kind of the mentality that I fall into where it's just like, if you can set this thing up to go automatic, you don't have to worry about it, um, and it's just gonna like grow with you. That's I mean, that's where I would like to be, but, um, it does depend on everyone's situation you know. Like some people are going to be fine waiting until they're in their thirties to get started and just like save a little bit more, you know, but, but some people would prefer to get, to get a head start on that. So it really comes down to personal preference, you know, like there's not one, one size fits all thing. 

Joseph: [00:40:07] It does. It does. And, and there's, and there's personal situations too. And there's also, I'm a big fan of the, uh, uh, the hierarchy of motivation, because I think a lot of people will, knowing that, you know, when their parents pass on, a knock on wood, they will have a house that access to them so wealth does tend to accumulate in family structures as well. So not, I mean, not everybody is, is so inclined to do that. I am, uh, because I, I want to make my own way, but like you say, not everybody, everybody has different priorities or responsibilities. Yep. All right. So this next one is going to be for our, for our dropshippers. Uh, the appeal of dropshipping is evident that we don't need to go over it each time. But, for people interested in dropshipping, there are other revenue streams, um, that you've talked about prior, um, bearing in mind that the main appeal of dropshipping is it's low cost and it's a low investment because they don't have to buy it themselves, they don't have to get a warehouse or anything like that. Can you think of any, or can you recommend any, um, any revenue streams or alternative, uh, income sources that, uh, our audience can look into? 

Apple Crider: [00:41:08] I think that's a great question. And so for me, my mind kind of goes to two places, just kind of based on my past experience with making money on the internet. And so, the first of which is to develop some kind of content that you're putting out on a consistent basis, whether it could be about drop shipping, that'd be very easy. You just kind of like, take videos of what you're doing and put them on the internet or record a podcast or make Instagram posts or take talks or whatever, like that's, that's round number one. And so that can, I mean, once you have a social presence established, like you can monetize that in so many different ways from affiliate marketing to sponsorships to do any number of things, you know, you can do with this, with this attention once you have it. So that's, I mean, that's round number one and I'm sure everybody knows about that, they thought about that. So, I would say that that's a good place to start first, but then, then the second place that I would think about going is in, in creating some kind of, um, virtual kind of agency to, to supplement what you do, what you're doing. And basically by that, I'm not talking like running Facebook ads for local businesses, because I'm sure you've heard that a thousand times between a million Facebook ads about that. So like, I'm not talking about that at all, but what I'm talking about is kind of putting together, uh, a team of people that can perform some kind of the task that is valuable. So for me, I was running this, this company for about two years and about one year, and we were producing podcasts for people and so I built this agency and basically I hired a bunch of podcasts editors, and then I was basically being the connection point between the podcast editors and the podcasters who needed their shows edited. So basically on my end, what I was responsible for was putting this website together, getting people in the door and then managing this entire team. And so, if you can find something that people are in need of in this case, it was podcasts editing, but it could be anything it's not all that difficult to put together a team of people. And for me, I think like, arbitraging this like across the world is like a really smart way to go because there's like a lot of very skilled talent in countries where the dollar goes a lot further. So, most of our people were hired from the Philippines and so we had this team of really skilled people in the Philippines, and we were basically connecting them with, with podcasters that needed their shows edited. So if you can find some kind of way to whether it is, um, in, in production work or whether it's in administrative work or whether it's in whatever, like if you can put together some kind of like, agency type model like that it can be really profitable and not require all that much upfront capital or just, um, just time to, to get this thing up and running.

Joseph: [00:43:30] Those are great. Um, I looked because I was looking into what you were doing. You did also mention too that your podcast, uh, was also a source of revenue. So, full disclosure, you know, our, our podcast here, I, me, I do kind of know the answers to these questions cause I've been in the podcast field, but I would love to hear, uh, in specific how you've, uh, maximize the returns on your podcast.

Apple Crider: [00:43:51] That's a great question. So, my podcast was a lot more of a revenue stream for me about two years ago. So, before the podcasting business I was running, like you're, you're running the whale, like Facebook ads agency, where I was working with small businesses and people and running Facebook ads for them and whatever. And so basically what, what I was using my podcast for was to generate leads for that company and how I would do that was the main clients that I worked with weren't actually local businesses. They were online entrepreneurs who need needed Facebook ads run for like their info products or just to sell stuff online. And so, I would interview those people on my podcast and then after the interview, I would have a quick conversation with them and be like, hey, just so you know, this is what I do for money is I run Facebook ads for people like you, um, and I would have built about an hour's worth of rapport with them. I would know a bit about what their issues are with their business and so I could really craft a, a kind of soft pitch to them on like, hey, here's what I do. Uh, do you have any interest? And if they said, no, I could ask them if they knew anybody who might. And so that was really how I was mainly monetizing. My podcast was just by interviewing the people that I wanted to work with and then doing business with them. And so, so that worked for a while and then after I kind of got out of that business, cause I didn't really like it that much. I wasn't really monetizing my show for a while, but now I'll do some sponsorships on there from time to time, which is pretty straight forward. I'm sure people have listened to podcasts. They've heard podcast sponsorships, but now, now I'll do that. And like, Podcast sponsorships aren't generally as lucrative as like sourcing leads for your own business, because with your own business, you keep all the money. Um, and it's it's, I mean, you can make a lot more money, like with, with one deal for the business that I was running, it was like multiple thousands of dollars. So like, that's, that's a lot more profitable than, than making maybe a couple of hundred bucks per podcast episode by running an ad for whatever company on it. So in the grand scheme of things, like there's a lot of ways to do it, but. If you can find a way to use it to generate leads or to sell products that you yourself create. That's where you're gonna get the most margin because there's nobody else involved and really it's just you and the consumer. So, I looked for ways you can do that, whether it's digital products, whether it is starting some kind of business, um, but, but that's where you're gonna get the most bang for your buck.

Joseph: [00:45:50] Uh, th that's, uh, that's some great insight, uh, and you reminded me that I also have to let our listeners know, uh, have you guys heard of raid shadow legends? It's this great mobile game. Um, actually it's I, again, uh, because I love being transparent. We actually have, I guess we're going to have a soft pitch for you when, uh, whenever guarding is up, just like, you know, it to interface with the beautify and like go building further relationship with it. So what, what, uh, what Apple is saying here, we do, we definitely do. So I, I, I totally back up that, um, that, and then sponsors, uh, feel free to reach out to us. So, the door's wide open. Um, so we're, I gotta tell you, this episode has been flying by we're already like 40, 49 minutes and not factoring the, uh, the, the two minutes where, you know, spillage, but that's, that's, that's crazy. This is the I'm amazed at how, uh, how well this has been flowing. Um, so, there's some important questions that I want to get your opinion on because you're so well versed in this subject. And for those of you wondering about like the sensitivity of these questions, I, I preset read them first just to make sure. Um, so remember early on, in the episode, you're talking about how credit card companies they win because people don't pay their, their fee on time and then they accumulated interest and then we win because, you know, we pay it on time, um, and you know, we have, uh, we, we, we ha we have a deck of them. Um, and somewhere in there, I want to do joke about like, yeah, you, you activated my track credit card, but I'm just going to just skip that. Now, there was a concern about the overall economic health of, of a country. And we'll talk about the USA because although I am in Canada, I identify really as like a, as an American, more than anything, I, I really do love your country. And, uh, and I, and I wish it well. Um, but there is disparity in the haves and the have nots it's, um, and, and some, some people would tell them, you know, you, you just got to get through high school and get a job and you'll end up being on your way. But, is it possible that our economic health is always going to depend on winners and losers or are, can we move towards a, uh, a fair and equitable system where we, we do have, like, everybody can be financially healthy and this isn't a matter of, by the way, I'm just not advocating for outright, uh, at issue to social programs and not taking position when we're you're another, um, but principally, countries, they tax people so that we can benefit everyone's welfare, but each country has different views on what you should be taxing and you know, what, um, what those taxes should pay for. So that's a lot, obviously there's a lot to unpack here, uh, but I do want to hear your overall opinions on what you would like to see in an economically healthy country.

Apple Crider: [00:48:33] Yeah. There's, there's definitely a lot to unpack there. So, I think the current state of the world has made some things pretty clear. And so a couple of those things that I think are worth talking about is like, so, so during this whole pandemic, you know, there's, there's been millions of people getting laid off. There's been tons of jobs getting lost. Um, but at the same time, the stock market's been flying, you know, like for the most part it's dogma is going higher and higher and higher. And so-so, that has sent some kind of confusing indicators to people about just how the world works, you know? And so people are saying like, Oh, well, we'll be like, Like the economy is going great. Like the stock market is going up, like what's the problem here. And the problem is that there's millions of people who have lost their jobs. So, there's this big disconnect between like the everyday individual and like the performance of the stock market and the performance of the stock market really doesn't impact the everyday individual all that much because when you look at the distribution of who actually owns stocks, about 70% of stocks are owned by the top of 1% of society. So, most of those gains that are being generated right now are being had by the very upper echelons of society and so like everyday person is not really sharing in those and the people on the news stations, the talking heads will tell you that, oh, well, it's benefiting everybody's pension plan and their retirement accounts. But in reality, like you look at 70% going to the top 1% and you're like, well, I mean, maybe like my retirement accounts going up a little bit, but in the grand scheme of things, I don't have a job right now so I'm not too concerned about that. So, I think that, that, that there really is a long ways to go in terms of just even just mentally realizing that the stock market is not really a very fair representation of how the country as a whole is doing. Uh, because I mean, yeah, looking at the country right now, it's like a lot of, stuff's not going very well and you have, the stock market is continuously going up. So that's, I think that's, that's a good first place to start, but in terms of like inequalities and in solving that via taxes, I mean, I,  I don't know. I try not to get too, too political with, uh, with stuff that I talk about. Um, just because, I mean, I'm not the most well-researched in, in this space, but I think, 

Joseph: [00:50:43] Sure. 

Apple Crider: [00:50:43] I think in general, we, we, we should be paying some kind of taxes. Like I'm not the whole like, libertarian, like shut everything down, like my money is my money. Like I think in general it is, it is good that we are paying some money to the government that is, theoretically, like elected by us to, to make decisions on our behalf. I think that's a good thing. And I think in general, like it works out all right. You know, it's, it's obviously not a perfect system, but I think it works out decently for the most part that we're giving money to the government and they're, they're allocating it in some way, but yeah. A lot of times that that allocation isn't exactly how we would like it. And a lot of times the people who are actually paying these taxes, um, aren't necessarily paying them in proportion how much money they're making. So, I think there's definitely a long ways to go to, to get to a real equitable system. Do I think it's possible? I mean maybe, but like the people at the top, I mean, the people at the top, we're just going to keep spending money to figure out how they can pay less in taxes. So it's like, uh, at a point it becomes, it becomes difficult to really envision what, what a, what a fully equitable system would look like. So I'm optimistic, but I don't, I don't think that there, there is really like a perfect system that we'll ever get to. S

Sure. Okay. 

Joseph: [00:52:01] Well, I do appreciate you waiting on a and a, and I'm going to make a, make two points. Um, the first one is in regards to the stock market. No, I'm not like pro 1% or anything like that, but, well, the disconnected that I would, uh, that I would want to try to clear up is the difference between money going into a vacuum, where it really is just a hoarded and, and people aren't being reinvested and nothing is happening to it. That's what I would have an issue with. Um, what it wouldn't have an issue with is a healthy stock market, because you would want to, you want to think that people are putting money into these investments to better society in some way to, again, contribute to that good they're investing in companies and maybe they're investing in globally. Maybe, you know, there's not investing into an American company, but, investments investing. He does have a history of, of yielding a lot of positives. It's people believing in other people's ability to make money and  we used the common language of profitability. So at least everybody's on the same page about it. So, my issue is the idea that money just like disappears from the economy. And it only appears in somebody who's an author, a bank account where it's just sitting there not doing anything that I have a serious problem with the second point that I, yeah. Right on, uh, the second one that I went to, uh, what I want to raise is, uh, my, my lawyer, uh, this was about like five years ago, but, uh, she, she, uh, she was telling me about this thing that was going on in the law practice, where they had to do this thing called a statement of principles where they would have, like, I don't know, like a chart on the back of their office about like, what are the principles? And, uh, and there's, and there's pushback between this. And she said, I probably would support the pushback because of my libertarian views, um, and it, my, my, my theory is that my lawyer thinks I'm libertarian. I'm not gonna fight her on it. Um, but being, being in Canada, there are, there is a, a pretty clear difference between tax and money being used for important programs like our military. Um, Police courts, um, and you know, healthcare, uh, I'm not like anti state healthcare. I think it's important that if I had dialed 911, I shouldn't have to like worry about a bill coming into something like that. So there should be, uh, some, uh, assistance from the state there. But at the same time, I also took my girlfriend swimming at a, at a state funded swimming pool. And there was only like a two hour window once a week where we were allowed to swim and it was packed because everybody got to use that two hour window and it was free. And well, you know, some people don't even really intend to go swimming and they just want to use the free showers. There was urine on the ground. It was not a pleasant experience. And I felt like, it's, I understand a lot of people depend on this because it, they, in a lot of young kids are in school. They use these programs and it probably benefits them. But what it's also doing is that it is stifling the ability for the private market to offer something in exchange. I've reached out to hotels to see if I can just like pay to use our swimming pool. And they say no. And so I do have an issue with. The taxes being used on stuff that actually makes it harder for other businesses to operate. 

Apple Crider: [00:55:04] Yeah, no, I agree. I think that there, there is a point where, where you're crowding out private enterprise too, to create solutions to problems that exist. And so, I mean, it's, it's a tough balancing act, man. I don't really envy many of these politicians who are making these decisions on an everyday basis, you know, like I, would not want to be in that position myself. And I realized there's a lot going on there that I'm not privy to, but I don't know. It's not a perfect system. There's a lot of, there's a lot of things that could be improved. Um, but am I the person that's going to go down to Capitol Hill and improve them? Absolutely. 

Joseph: [00:55:38] Yeah. Yeah. That's fair. Well, I hope people would take away a little bit of this and just use it as an opportunity to think about their own views because. And by the way, this is like a thing where, you know, you'll see like a celebrity weighing in, on politics on Twitter or something like that. And you say, well, hey, you're an actor don't weigh in. No, no, no, no, no. Everybody gets to weigh in because the last thing you want is a system where the only people talking, are it?

Apple Crider: [00:56:02] Yeah, no, absolutely. Absolutely. 

Joseph: [00:56:05] Um, yeah. Okay. Well this one, this one is going to be for fun, so, and then I'm going to give you the, uh, the, the wrap-up question. So, one thing that I did at the start of my thirties was to lay out a life plan, uh, because as millennials, uh, I'm on like the first wave of millennial, maybe second wave, and we have the luxury slash curse of possibly living to like 200 years old. And maybe we'll get blasted off into space. So it's important to have a plan of like, what, what am I going to do in my thirties? What I'm going to do in my forties? What am I doing my fifties? And for my audience, I'm happy to share this because I want people to know about me, but in my thirties, I'm sticking to my medium producing because it's been going really well for me in my forties and going into like my creative writing side. Uh, in fifties, I actually do want to get into public service. So, I do find it fascinating. And I'm about as much of a fan of the theater side, but I am a fan of the, the actual tangible, like how trying to help people in a, in a, in a net positive way. Uh, in my sixties, this is where I've kind of run out of ideas. My placeholder right now is to try to beat up all the bullies who picked on me in school. But again, that's a placeholder. I don't know if I'm committing to that. Um, uh, but I was wondering at 21 years old, if you've done anything similar, if you have kind of like a vision for what you want to do, when you hit 30, you hit 40 hit 50, and then by 70 get blasted off into space.

Apple Crider: [00:57:27] Well, um, uh, I'll tell you a short answer is no. Um, I am somebody who does not, I, I plan my next, I plan one day out pretty pretty strictly, but, um, beyond one day it's, it's kind of, it's kind of a blur. So, I mean, for, for context, I moved to New York, like, two or three days ago, um, with maybe like.. 

Joseph: [00:57:52] Wow. 

Two 

Apple Crider: [00:57:52] weeks of planning. Um, so I, I really do value the flexibility that I have right now with not being tied down to many things at all. So, so for me, I, I very much prefer to just like be in the now and be present and just kind of, uh, let that kind of guide where I want to go. And so I'm not looking to kind of lay out a roadmap for my life right now. I'm more so just really looking to learn more about myself, learn more about the world and where I can potentially fit into it and just, and, uh, just kind of ride that. So, yeah, I mean, I, I admire the yeah, um, the, the, the, the laying out of the future, but, um, I guess it's not, it's not, not really my style.

Joseph: [00:58:32] That's fair. And when I was in my, in my twenties, I, I didn't do it either. Um, I think, um, in our, in the way, our, our expectations for age versus life milestones, again, those expectations can be more spread out, you know, once upon a time people made it to 30 and did thought it was a miracle. So, um, I would say that, you know, my, I characterize my twenties as kind of like my teens around the, to where I, where I was still trying to figure things out and try to get my place in the world, but, uh, you know, 10 years as long way away. And I, and I, and congratulations on everything you've pulled off so far. So, and I know the 10, 10 years with your momentum.

Apple Crider: [00:59:08] Yeah, exactly. 

Joseph: [00:59:13] Awesome. So, uh, we're gonna, we're gonna get you out of here. Uh, if you have any parting words of wisdom now that you haven't supplied plenty already, but if there's anything else you want to leave with the audience, I give the floor to you once more and also, uh, let the audience know how they can reach out to you.

Apple Crider: [00:59:26] Yeah, no, I think, I think the main thing that I want to leave people with is just like, take a couple breaths and just be present for a few moments. Um, I, I'm a big proponent of, just like being in the moment. I think it's very easy to get caught up in, in life and plans and just like all this stuff that just gets you loaded for the future. So I think you can just take a couple moments and just like, like be for a bit. I mean, I think that that would be a good use of time. So that's what I got for that. And then in terms of following up, um, I guess just search for Apple Crider anywhere you want to, I'm pretty active on YouTube and posting once a day for probably like a month or so. So, um, check me out there. You can find my podcast junk spare money. You should be a DM on Instagram, wherever, wherever you want to. And then it's Apple and then Crider is spelled like cider with an R there. So C R I D E R and a yeah. Hope to hear from you guys. 

Joseph: [01:00:17] All right, everybody. Well, uh, I hope you had a, I hope you had a good time with this. Uh, I certainly did, uh, Apple once again. Thank you for your time and for your knowledge. All right, listeners. We'll we'll check in with you soon. 

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