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Jacob Bozarth - Harness The Potential Of Podcasting In The Age Of Communication

icon-calendar 2021-02-03 | icon-microphone 1h 14m 43s Listening Time | icon-user Debutify CORP
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Jacob Bozarth, gave me a rare chance to talk shop being a podcaster himself. What at one point was considered a hobby by pretty much, everybody is now a flourishing industry all its own. With mine's like is at the helm. Now, statistically, everyone either pass a podcast or wants to make one. And I defer to the expertise of our guests to know what it's going to take and what's in it for you. 

Jacob founded Resonate Recordings in 2014. Since founding and growing Resonate Recordings to be a leading podcast production platform, Jacob has produced the hit podcast, Culpable, and done audio work on many well-known podcasts. Jacob also earned a Bachelor of Science in Recordings from MTSU in 2011 and a Masters of Arts from Southern Seminary in 2014.

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Jacob Bozarth: [00:00:00] Like about the shows and arrest step back and think about what are the reasons why I like the shows that are really, really like it's, it's that level of authenticity. And I feel like I'm there with them. And there's that deep sense of, uh, you just feel like you're, you're along for the ride. You're, it's, it's a very intimate experience of experiencing that.

And so I think that's, that's one of the cool things about podcasting. It's very intimate medium, intimate form of medium

Joseph: [00:00:32] You're listening to Ecomonics, a Debutify podcast. Your resource for one of a kind insights into the world of e-commerce and business in the modern age. This is Joseph. I'll be presenting a wealth of industry knowledge from interviews, with successful business people and our own state-of-the-art research. Your time is valuable, so let's go.

Jacob Bozarth, gave me a rare chance to talk shop being a podcaster himself. What at one point was considered a hobby by pretty much, everybody is now a flourishing industry all its own. With mine's like is at the helm. Now, statistically, everyone either pass a podcast or wants to make one. And I defer to the expertise of our guests to know what it's going to take and what's in it for you. 

Jacob Bozarth,  uh, welcome. It is good to have you here on ecomonics. How are you doing today? How are you feeling? 

Jacob Bozarth: [00:01:27] Doing well, thanks for having me. I'm really excited to be here and to speak with you today. 

Joseph: [00:01:32] This is one of those times I am relieved that this is an audio only show because we do have a video on, so Jacob and I can see each other.

And, uh, on his side, he's got gorgeous immaculate layout with the padding all across. I can't see anything that's not padding. And I'm in a closet with a, with a divider and some adhesives that are stuck from some panels that I tried to put up and then they, they fell off. So. Yeah. Yeah. I, uh, I, I definitely have a long way to go.

I might've spent some time looking through your content, uh, about, um, budgeting and what we can invest in and got me some ideas there. So.

Jacob Bozarth: [00:02:07] Yeah. Very cool. Well, uh, I appreciate that, but I'll have to say your lighting is much better than mine. I'm in this dark little room, so I'm glad we're doing audio only.

Joseph: [00:02:18] Well, I'll take my winds where I can get them. So we have a podcaster here today. Um, not just a podcaster, but one who runs his own. I was about to say agency, but I guess company is probably the most accurate term. 

Jacob Bozarth: [00:02:33] Yeah. Yeah, definitely. So, um, initially we kind of started as a podcast editing firm podcast production company, and now we've kind of evolved into doing a little bit of everything.

So our, our taglines, an easier way to podcast and really, we just. Exists to help podcasters from beginning to end all the way from initially learning what equipment to buy all the way to, how to distribute their shows and get it on Apple, Google, Spotify, and all the different directories.

Joseph: [00:02:56] Would you blame me if I just splice in the who you are, what you do question afterwards, we'll, you know, we, we got, we got the answer out of the way, so we're just gonna, uh, we're just, we're just gonna power through it, but this is the first, this is the first time that I didn't do the who you are, what you do.

Jacob Bozarth: [00:03:08] Yeah. It's up to you. I mean, we can certainly go back. 

Joseph: [00:03:12] Oh, no, no, this is all, this is all. This is only, this is maybe just a riff and now I'm just enjoying myself because, um, I am quite passionate about podcasting. I would give it like, I don't know if it's like my number one, definitely the top five. I think my number one is still Zelda, but podcasting has changed my life.

Um, and every year that I get to be a part of the podcasting world, it continues to evolve and shape me. And so I have a lot of gratitude for, for the industry and, um, And I know you guys do too, because of how it's managed to do so much for you and reshape your life. Cause I know from having looked at your, uh, your, your backstory, I don't think you saw this coming right.

You had a very different, uh, a different outlook. So we'll get to that. But first question, this is a very basic question. Uh, well, we're going to skip the what as a podcast one, because I'm pretty sure everybody listening to this, figure that part out. Uh, if you are somebody who don't know what a podcast is, but you're listening to this, I really want to know more about you.

So, uh, podcast@debutify.com. But the one that I want to ask you is a foundational question for our listeners who maybe they're on the fence about doing one themselves, or they actually don't feel like doing one themselves, but why do a podcast. 

Jacob Bozarth: [00:04:23] Yeah, that's, that's really a great question. You know, I think podcasting is a medium, like you said, that it's just exploded over the last several years.

And I think, I think there are several reasons as to why it's exploded and why we're seeing it go for more of the indie movement to now more of the mainstream players getting involved in essentially, you know, everyone kind of having a podcast. Now, everyone listening to a podcast. I think one of the, one of the main reasons is, you know, People are listening the audiences there, um, there's that accessibility of everyone has an, almost everyone has an iPhone or a smartphone of some kind.

I think I saw that like 94% of Americans at least own a smartphone. And so everyone has one and all those smartphones, they come with a native podcast app now on them. And so everyone's listening to everyone has that. So you have really a captive audience of people listening. And so if you, if you don't have a podcast, I would say you're definitely missing out on a huge audience there that are eagerly waiting to listen to content, to consume content.

Um, I saw you all, you know, back in the summer, hit over a hundred thousand, uh, listeners or downloads. And so that's, that's remarkable to think about a hundred thousand people. You know, it may seem like a small feat whenever you think about some of the other shows that are getting millions of downloads in the top charts and stuff like that.

But if you just pause to think about. A room of a hundred thousand people that you have listening to you and you're on a stage. It kind of changes your perspective whenever you think about it that way. And I tell a lot, we tell a lot of our clients that, you know, you know, if they just have a couple hundred downloads per episode, maybe even to think about a room of a hundred people.

A hundred cap, a hundred people that are a captive audience, ready to listen to you. That's pretty powerful. And your message is getting shared with them over and over and over. And a lot of them are very loyal listeners or coming back week after week after week. And so, yeah, it's just a very powerful tool, a powerful way to get your message across.

And I think a lot of that comes down to the accessibility now that we have of people being able to listen to podcasts pretty much anywhere. Anywhere, however they can, especially with people being at home now more than ever while they're working out while they're maybe taking a walk, um, people listen to podcasts everywhere, you know, in, in the gym, maybe not so much right now, but, uh, you know, on your commutes, everything like that.

Joseph: [00:06:45] So I, I'm going to feel a little bad about this, but the a hundred thousand downloads you're referencing are the downloads for our debutify template. Um, that's as far as the, the downloads that I had seen, we, we hit 2k downloads and we don't have the stats for Spotify. So we are doing well. But, um, overall, our we're, I'm still thrilled at that engagement, by the way.

Uh, because within the window of six months, we have people who are, uh, checking out and one metric that sticks out to me is also that our episodes are well, we have interview episodes, but they also have episodes where it's just me talking and I was checking the downloads for them because I checked them each month.

So far. And people are listening to those too. So it's not just like people are coming in and going with the influencers and the guests that they're fans of people are sticking around and they're consuming this other content where it's just me talking. And that's something that, that means a lot to me as well.

Jacob Bozarth: [00:07:37] Absolutely. Yeah, I think that's definitely one of the benefits that, that you can gain from an interview style podcasts is you might be able to pull in different audience, an audience of someone else who, like you said, it's an influencer, but in that, you know, in your branded podcasts, they're hearing your message.

They're hopefully enjoying your content and going to come back and listen. And you, it provides a level of engagement with those listeners that that's really powerful. 

Joseph: [00:08:00] I also want to offer up another point to our, to the ether here about a incentive for making a podcast is this is also an opportunity for the person who is making the show to experience, uh, accelerated growth, because it gives them leverage.

It gives them a reason to engage with somebody and punch up to, you know, they can, they can definitely punch above their weight class and be the person who talks to somebody else with a little bit more cloud going for them, which has. That's definitely been the relationship with between tweeting me and the people that I talked to.

Uh, I. I don't mind. It's, it's great to be able to learn from people at, at their, at their level. And so for me personally, the, the growth that I've experienced and the lessons that I've learned and I've been absorbing has been unbelievable. I can't, I got a lot of the, the conversations that I have with people.

It's what I'm reviewing the content afterwards. I can have a little more time to breathe and absorb what they're saying, because there's so much information coming in. So even if, uh, we'll, we'll get to the revenue stuff, cause there definitely are ways to monetize it. But I just want to hammer home the idea that making a podcast is a great way to continue to learn and to give yourself an opportunity to grow, teach yourself, have a run, something, but also get more information from the people that you talk to. 

Jacob Bozarth: [00:09:14] Yeah, that's a great point. Um, just to think about the diverse audience that you are, the divergence, um, the different people that you've had on this show and the opportunity to get to learn from them in different, different specialties and finding people that are maybe better than you in a certain area, and really learn from them and their experience and their knowledge is, is pretty cool.

Joseph: [00:09:34] So one thing I picked up from your, uh, interview on the podcast business journal of spotlight was, uh, you were approached to mix and master a podcast. And at the time you didn't have aspirations to become a podcast editor. This was the same for me, by the way. Um, and I bet this is a common theme where people end up not realizing that podcasting is going to end up becoming a career for them.

So at that time, what did you expect would become of the industry? Did you see the path laid out for you. Like what did you, what was going on in your head when this was your first chance to edit content for somebody else in this way? 

Jacob Bozarth: [00:10:08] Yeah, that's a great question. Um, you know, at the time, so I have a background in audio engineering and just really love the, the studio environment and kind of fell in love with, with that experience.

And even before that, um, was a musician and that's kind of how I fell and fell in love with the recording arts. And so initially, whenever I was working with this, uh, podcaster, his name is Payne Lindsey had a kind of a hit true crime show up in vanished that helps solve an 11 year old cold case. And so at that time I was, that's all another story in itself.

So at that time, I mean, I was just thrilled to get to do something that I love, that I was passionate about working in the audio space and really kind of just saw podcasting as, very small piece of that, you know, I didn't really know that it would turn into the platform that it has turned into over the last five years or so. Um, so I was doing recording music and, uh, even helping some churches out with their sermon audio and getting that online, distributing that also then podcasting was just kind of another section of that. And so, yeah, as podcasting grew, you know, I really saw that there was a huge opportunity there and really kind of no one in the space that, that.

You know, even going, I went to school for audio and there were no classes on podcasts or how to, how to edit a podcast or how to mix a podcast. And so really saw an opportunity to kind of bring that experience and that expertise of professional audio background into the podcasting space. And specifically with that show, I just enjoyed that show up and vanished.

I was a fan before I started working with Payne. And so I was just thrilled to get to work on it kind of as a fan boy. And like it's a get to work on a show that I enjoyed was entertained by. Um, and like you said, you learned so much, even while you're working on the content, you know, if you're getting to work with other people or getting to interview other people, you go back and you listen to that and you learn and you hear different things.

Maybe the second time, the third time you listen to it, by the time you've listened to it over and over and over. If you're doing the post-production and doing the editing, you really learn a lot. And then as our client base kind of grew like yourself, you know, there a much. A diverse client base. And so I get to learn about fitness podcast and all these different things.

And so it's a really cool opportunity to get to do that. And I'll say now, you know, we have a team of about 30, so I don't actually edit many podcasts these days. Um, but, but yeah, I really still, still do enjoy and actively a podcast consumer. Um, in addition to, you know, having a full-time job in the podcasting space.

Joseph: [00:12:30] Yeah. I appreciate what you said about the studio environment. There is something different about the way a studio environment vibrates outside of, you know, compared to outside, even compared to the lobby. And I think what it is is everything in that room is heightened. Which means that everything has to be treated much more carefully.

So even if somebody scratches themself in on or on the subway, it distinguishable from everything else. But in the studio, every little thing suddenly has so much more way to, and so much more gravity to it that it does take a lot of extra eye care to, uh, to run that environment. That's real, it's relativity in, in point effect.

Jacob Bozarth: [00:13:09] Absolutely. Yeah, no, that's, that's a hundred percent right. And I think also just, just the beauty of being able to, to capture something and then come back and hear it again, and to be able to build, build upon it, whether it is a podcast or whether it's music, you know, you can, you can build those layers in, you know, with your Oz, even like intro and outro and, um, you know, that that's cool.

It has an impact. It really captures people's I think emotions and, uh, th that's true. Just a really cool art to get, to record something and then hear it back and kind of see your masterpiece come to life. Um, there's a lot of fun in that and it's a find very gratifying. 

Joseph: [00:13:44] There was this one, uh, uh, show I used to edit where he would interview, uh, comedians and I'm blanking on the name.

And I feel bad for that. But, uh, one of the stories that he told was about how. Uh, he got so wasted that he woke up and he was on a bike in motion on the street. 

Jacob Bozarth: [00:14:01] Wow. 

Joseph: [00:14:02] Stuff like that. Still, like, it still sticks with me. I still remember stuff like that. I remember another show. I was just a listener of.

So, uh, but it's just these things that they stick with us. And throughout our lives, I must have listened to this celebrity chef Brad Long. And you just made this point about how good food is energizing. It's supposed to energize you when people eat this junk food and they, they feel tired. It's this? No, that's not what food is about.

And I don't want to delve too much into that, but it's just all of these things that take that we take with us, um, over time. Uh, I can, uh, we can, we can gush all day over this, but I got, I got a question for you. I'm really excited to ask this next question. So yeah. One job, one job, actually the same comedy podcast, uh, incidentally, um, there were, there was an episode where the host audio dropped for the last 10 minutes and they didn't realize it.

So what the host had to do was he had to come back in and he had to rerecord all of his lines. And then I had to splice it in line by line and I sent it to them. They check it out and says, wow, that was. I couldn't even tell. And I said, well, thank you very much for that, you know, uh, uh, four year is going on. I haven't lost a patient. 

So, uh, how, what are, can you, are there any like operations or any exceedingly difficult circumstances that you were, that were thrust upon you that, uh, got you, man? 

Jacob Bozarth: [00:15:18] That's that's a great question. Yeah, I'll say one. Um, Specifically, we, we were recording for, uh, the associated press at the time, and they were doing a, uh, it was, uh, uh, coverage of the Olympics.

And so they were specifically actually, uh, I think, I think they were in Russia at the time. Maybe. A group of them were. And so we were trying to record, you know, we had to do this live recording. Um, from there I say, live, we were recording it at the time and then obviously doing the post-production on site.

So it wasn't like a live distribution, but yeah, the platform we were using actually was blocked in Russia. And so, um, we had to find another solution to figure out how can we. What are what's what is another platform we can use? And so at that time, I think it was like three in the morning or something like that.

I had to go dig it out on the internet, kind of find what's another option for recording something remotely that we can use. And so, uh, thankfully I was able to find another platform. And, uh, we were able to bypass the issue there and capture the audio. And, uh, there's oftentimes I think, and that was an instance where the quality of the audio was kind of sub-par and you have to make the most of it like yourself, or even go back and re recorded the other times.

And so. Yeah, I think that that's one of the really cool things and all the technology that's emerging, all the different platforms, all the different tools. And obviously we hope to, to contribute to that as a small piece as well at resonate. Um, but I think that's, that's one of the really exciting and cool things is just the, the emerging amount of, of, uh, different resources, different equipment, different tools that are specifically designed to record podcasting.

And I think, you know, we're, we've seen that even. Become more escalated now with the everyone going to remote with the pandemic, everyone knowing how to use zoom. Now, everyone knowing how to do a video call or a video recording. And we have a lot of clients that even use zoom to record their podcast. And I think that's one of the things why podcasting is such an appealing, uh, platform in a way to get your message out is the barrier to entry is pretty low. And I would say even more than ever, it's lower than it's ever been, uh, to be able to record a somewhat high quality podcast, to share your content, to share your message with a, with an audience that's out there. And so I'd say it's a, it's a prime time, a great opportunity to start a podcast if you're, if you're thinking about that. 

Joseph: [00:17:43] One thing that I ever call, and maybe you can, um, uh, support or even refute this. But I remember, I think during the first couple of months of the, uh, of those initial, uh, major lockdowns, I remember reading that podcasting had actually taken a hit in listenership.

And I think a lot of that had to do with the fact that people were used to traveling and commuting. And so they would use podcasting as a way to fill that time, which is what I, I do. Uh, I, I did that for, for many, many years until I started working remote about a year before. Uh, it all happened. Um, did any of that across your radar as well? Or am I just crazy? 

Jacob Bozarth: [00:18:22] No, you're a hundred percent correct yet that whenever the initial lockdown happened, uh, there was a pretty significant decrease in, in podcast and consumption. And that kind of shook the whole industry at the time, especially the ads, you know, if people kind of like, okay, do we need to quit spending ads on these podcasts, quit putting so much money out there if the level of listenership is going down.

And so, yeah, it definitely wasn't impact. I know, even for myself, like that's the primary. Times that I listened to podcasts whenever I'm commuting, or if I'm exercising or going for a walk or something like that. I don't usually just sit around and listen to podcasts. And I think that as an primarily audio platform, that's one of the great things about it is you can listen to it while you're driving.

Keep your eyes on the road. You don't have to watch it or anything like that. So that's one of the cool, cool things about the medium itself as an audio first platform. I will say I've, I've seen that the listeners, I think have picked back up, I think I've seen some recent stats that it's picked back up with some people getting back into work.

Um, I'm not sure. I mean, I would guess that people still aren't commuting as much as they were back in, you know, say February of this past year. Um, but yeah, I've. I know that I know that the listenership, supposedly at least has picked back up from what I've heard. Um, and we've seen, you know, even a huge increase in new people, starting a podcast now more than ever over the last six months, you know, we've, we've had, um, kind of record months in our company across the board. And, and I know, um, several other partners in the industry that have said the same of, they've just seen this huge influx of people, starting podcasts to people, listening to podcast. And so that's really encouraging to hear, um, I know in, in the midst of everything that's happened this year and everything, that's going on.

Joseph: [00:20:09] One point that I want to, uh, address too, because it's going to transition us right into this next set of questions. Which are all going to be some actionable tips and strategies and stuff that our listeners can pick up on. Um, which is just that you said that how easy it is now, how for entry entry-level content creators, you don't need a lot of money. All you need to know is really know something and either be able somebody who disseminates information or collects information like an interview or whatever the case is, all of which is to say, this question that I want to ask is what would you recommend as like the podcast, uh, essentials or podcasts starter kit, you know, something to survive in the wilderness for a day, kind of starter kit.

Jacob Bozarth: [00:20:50] Yeah, that's a great question. Um, so I would say, first of all, you know, you, you have to figure out what your messages are. What's your, what's your story is what's the content that you're sharing with your listener? Is it an interview style podcast? Is it a story-driven podcast? Is it a, you know, a long form, true crime narrative podcasts, right.

Um, so I'd say that's definitely. The first piece is your content. You have to know your content, know what it is. What's the message that you're sharing with your, with your audience. Um, secondly, I would say, you know, you need a microphone. I am using the USB microphone. That's about a hundred dollars. I think it's actually like 70, 69, $70.

It's the Audio-Technica AT2005. There are several other great, uh, USB microphones that are under a hundred dollars that you can get. So I'd say, you know, Around a hundred dollar USB microphone. And I was saying, you know, most people have a computer. Um, so if you have a computer, the USB microphone is a great, uh, great thing to do.

And then a pair of headphones or earbuds, if you don't have, you know, one of those things, like I would, I would strongly recommend that, but I mean, we have some clients that they do use the built-in mic on their computer, or even on their phone. And those can work, you know, as a starting point. Um, certainly like I said, technology has come a long way.

Um, and it's, you know, cool to hear that. So a lot of people get hung up on feeling like they have to get a recording console or a soundboard or anything like that. And really kind of go, go to school to, to understand how to use the equipment. That's not the case. You know, that's really kind of why resonate exist is to remove the, uh, the, the complexity of that.

Technical aspects of podcasting and just to make it as easy as possible. So you can focus on just recording and speaking about what your passenger about, uh, what your message is and sharing that and not worrying about all the technical aspects. So, yeah, microphone, headphones, and then a computer. If you don't have a computer, uh, another great tool is a zoom handheld recorders.

As we made six, as we make five, um, those are both great and you can plug a microphone directly and you can plug up to four microphones. Uh, the way the six comes as is. Uh, there are several other great tools out there as well. Like the road podcaster. I think it is. That's, uh, in several other kind of specific, I think zoom actually just rolled out like another kind of console that's built for podcasting.

I don't want to say it has up to eight inputs and has like some basic faders and stuff like that. Even those, those can overwhelm people at times as well. So. Can we try to keep it as simple as possible. I know we're using Zencaster to record this. There's another platform out there. We really like called squad cast and also Riverside FM is another one that records audio and video it really high quality, but you can even use like zoom, zoom, um, To record there's some settings.

We actually have a blog post on how to record a podcast using zoom, and everyone knows how to use zoom. That's one of the great things. We have some large corporations we work with and they're like, Hey, we want to record on zoom. Cause everybody knows how to use it. That's okay. We can make that work. Um, and sometimes we'll record the audio on our end.

But yeah, there's a lot of great tools, very, very easy and simple to use. 

Joseph: [00:23:52] Just a quick anecdote about zoom back. When I was living with my parents, March, April, I'm going to say around like April, they hit him having four other siblings. They wanted to get together to have a zoom call, uh, in lieu of an Easter get together.

Uh, so I guess it would have to, would have been April. And they said, well, dad, okay. So there's five of you and you're all like past 60. So statistically speaking, one of you is going to have connection issues and is going to be like..

Jacob Bozarth: [00:24:22] Oh, that's funny. Yeah. 

Joseph: [00:24:24] Also I have to say, um, I didn't know what microphone you were. Cause my ears are only so attuned to pick up, like, you know, What who's using, what I mean, I can, I can kind of guess when someone's using a, a Yeti, but that's, uh, we don't want to, we don't want to get into that, but for like less than a hundred dollars, that microphone is doing a pretty darn good job.

If there's like a Valhalla for microphones that the Valkyrie will select that microphone and bring it to the, to the, to the, yeah. 

Jacob Bozarth: [00:24:54] Yeah. Very cool. Well, I appreciate that. Yeah. There's um, We really liked the dynamic microphones and really all that means is they pick up what's right in front of the microphone.

It's more of a broadcast style mic, like your electro voice re20, and like the Shure SM7b's a really popular one. Um, so I really like those. There's several other different ones. Uh, Samsung makes a great one. Shure, actually just rolled out. Uh, I think it's a, um, B seven, which is their USB version of their um, so those, you know, all those microphones that are USB dynamic, they tend to work well. They're very simple. Uh, it's just like a volt, essentially a vocal microphone, but yeah, it's, it's, uh, it works well. It picks up your mic and that's, that's what you want to hear is, you know, clear, uh, voice. 

Joseph: [00:25:41] And, and listeners for those of you who are listening consistently, you know what I'm about to say, but with the time that we have with our guests, but don't what can not possibly encapsulate everything.

So if you haven't already considered going to check out resident recordings website, I strongly suggest you do that. I did for prep and I can see myself going back there even to pick up on things too. Cause me, I, I, I go to, I go to pod camp every year, except there's one year that I managed to sleep an entire weekend.

I don't know. I was impressed with myself, those sides. I wake up on Sunday. I go, what? But I'll, if, if I say like a podcasting one on one class, I take it because I love the idea that maybe there's like a fundamental building block that I missed out on all these years. I would completely revitalize my, my approach for it.

Uh, the other thing too, I just wanted to offer up for listeners who are curious, what microphone I'm using all this time is that this is a zoom H4N and which it has  five built in capsules and is also, it's known for being a highly mobile as well. So, now, this one is a little more expensive. I got it around like 250 Canadian.

Um, so it has been more of an investment to it, but it's, I just wanted to throw it into the mix because I love zoom they're they really are a fantastic company.

Jacob Bozarth: [00:26:52] Yeah, they are. That's really cool. I didn't realize you were actually using the zoom h4 indenture mic. That's really cool. And yeah it sounds good.

Joseph: [00:27:00] Before we, uh, we met, I may have adjusted my camera just to keep it off screen. Cause I wasn't sure if like, you know, the zoom, I was like acceptable or anything like that. Uh, yeah. Uh, so we're we're we're cool. We're cool. Uh, okay. So, well I think we we've, we more or less covered most of the essentials, but there's one key component leftover, which would be the actual platform distribution of getting it to the masses. 

So, um, people need an RSS feed, which stands for rich site summary. And, uh, what are your recommendations for getting, uh, people to get their podcasts out onto the market? 

Jacob Bozarth: [00:27:35] Yeah, that's a great question. Um, so. I will, uh, full transparency. We actually released our own hosting platform that we built internally back in July.

And so, you know, obviously I'm going to recommend that if, uh, especially for the clients that we work with, our, uh, you know, our tagline, like I said, it's an easy way to podcast. And really that was the reason why we built our own hosting platform is because we wanted to make it as easy as possible to not just for the post-production editing, uh, all the intro and outro, getting everything set up, but also to be able to distribute their shows.

Um, now with that being said, there are a ton of other great hosting platforms out there, and we have great partnerships with, with a lot of the major, major other providers. Um, Buzzsprout is a great platform. They also have a ton of great resources on their website on how to start a podcast, you know, editing, uh, Editing support, you know, obviously they, they include us in that and point back to us, um, podbeans, and other great hosting platform.

And then Libsyn they've been around forever. They're kind of the grandfather of the industry. 

Joseph: [00:28:38] Um, so we're hosted with. 

Jacob Bozarth: [00:28:41] Very cool. Yeah. So all your, you know, all your hosting platforms, they're going to provide you with basic analytics, usually an embed player, that type of thing. Uh, so, you know, Oh, SIEM platform like said, provides an RSS feed, distributes out to all the different directories and some of them provide like, Dynamic ad insertion ability.

Different things like that. Some of them can connect you with sponsors. If you're interested in getting, getting different sponsors on your show or different ad spots. Now, um, one thing I will say is we have a blog post and we kind of highlight like why we like each of the different hosting providers, because they all kind of specialize in, you know, for different types of podcasts for networks, right.

You might consider like megaphone, um, who typically they don't work with just like a, an indie podcast or on their, on their own. Um, there's another great platform transistor. So, yeah, there's a lot of great hosting platforms out there. Like I said, if you just Google search podcast hosting, I think our blog posts should show up on the first page.

And so, you know, we, we kind of give an overview of why we like different platforms for different reasons. Um, but yeah, check out resonate hosting as well. We actually have a 14 day free trial that you can give us a test. Um, one cool thing I will say is we have. Embed player analytics that give you details into like, when someone fast forwards, like right now, someone might be like, this guy's talking way too long.

He's going off on a ramble. I'm going to fast forward. So you can see that if you're listening through the embedded player, through our embed player, um, or if someone, you know, skips or listens on two X speeds scrubs along. Um, so that that's one of the cool features. And obviously we're continuing to develop and build out new features and kind of listening to our clients what they want, what they.

Uh, what would they would like to see next? 

Joseph: [00:30:20] You know, I just had this thought that sponsors might, uh, end up wanting to find out if people are going to scrub past anytime that somebody reads the, uh, the, the ad hits on it. Uh, usually, usually I don't, but once in a while I will scroll past them. I I'm already subscribing to quip guys.

I already have it. You don't need, I don't need to hear each time. I know how to brush. Yeah. I mean if it's all right. I actually just want to throw like one other platform into the mix because it's one that I've been using personally. Yeah. So, uh, I use, uh, pine cast. Um, this is just like, you know, my own personal projects and for a really, really low key starter for people who just like the they're, the people who are like recording into their laptop microphone, uh, pine cast uses Amazon AWS as their web hosting.

So you can go directly to Amazon, AWS if you want. But pine cast is a user-friendly interface. Um, I, I, my, my, a lot of my personal projects are on there too, so. Uh, I would, uh, I would also check them out. That's my personal seal of approval. I don't want to like, you know, conflict of interest or anything like that, but I am a big guy.

Jacob Bozarth: [00:31:22] Yeah, no, it looks like a good platform. Looks like they have a, like you said, a pretty, uh, they have a free plan that looks like, so yeah, most, most of your hosting plans are gonna vary from free to $25 a month. Um, so typically it's something that the people kind of. So set up, you have to have it obviously, and then kind of forget about it for month to month.

So,

Joseph: [00:31:47] All right. So the next two questions, uh, for funds is going to be revenue and next one's going to be marketing. So revenue first. Our listeners, uh, the core of our audience, we always presume are dropshippers or interested in drop-shipping or ecom based or running a store. And so for them to invest into this, aside from the reasons that we stated before, uh, about clout and personal growth and being able to collect and disseminate information, lots of good reasons, but people also need to know that they can generate revenue off of it.

So, uh, how do we make money off a podcast? 

Jacob Bozarth: [00:32:19] Yeah, that's a great question. And an often question that we're asked, um, so, you know, the, the kind of most conventional way to make money off of podcasts would be to sell ads on your show. So that would be, you know, you might say, Hey, I'm going to put a blue apron ad on my show and I'm going to, I'm going to make, you know, $25 per a thousand downloads.

I get. That's the most common way that we see, um, especially with a lot of the more entertainment driven podcast or, you know, not just entertainment, but any type of a podcast that's getting over 10,000 downloads per episode. There's, there's several different ways you can go about doing that. You can.

Either basically become a part of a network and have someone sell ads on your behalf. Um, there's some other platforms as well, such as like advertise cast is one where you can go, you can put your it's like a marketplace. You can put your show on there. You can put how many downloads you get essentially, and then different different sponsors can buy ads on your show based off of that. And how many downloads you get there? So that's know there's one side of it. 

Joseph: [00:33:19] Sorry to cut you off this one side of it that I haven't really like been able to have any tangible experience with, which is when they offer, when the platform will. All right. Sorry. I'm so inexperienced with this.

I'm not even sure how to characterize it, but I put out the episode and then the platform wants to insert an ad on their own. Uh, you know what I'm talking about? Like, have you seen how this actually plays? 

Jacob Bozarth: [00:33:41] Yeah. Like a dynamic ad insertion. 

Joseph: [00:33:43] That sounds right. Yeah. Uh, yeah, most of the, a lot of the hosting providers do have that technology.

Jacob Bozarth: [00:33:48] Um, that's something we are working on. And so you basically, you, you can put in a timestamp, right? So like, after you asked me this question in post, you want to put in a, a time marker that says, okay, insert an ad here. And then, uh, the, yeah, the hosting providers you're correct. Will insert an ad. And that's where, like you can, some of the hosting providers, I know Podbean and Libsyn, I think megaphone as well.

They actually will sell ads on your behalf. And so you can turn that on, you do a rev rev share split with them. It might be like 50 50, or it might be like 70, 30, depending on the terms. That's, that's similar, essentially what it would be with like advertised cast, for example, they would take a percentage, you would get a percentage of it obviously, and they would pay you out for those.

Um, but yeah, you can certainly do the dynamic ad insertion. And that, that is something that, uh, that is an option there. Now, one thing I will say in our friends over at Buzzsprout are a huge proponent that. Proponent of this is basically don't sell ads on your show because you know, it's not worth what you would give up or what you would make off that unless you have, you know, a hundred thousand downloads per episode, right?

If you have a hundred thousand dollars per episode, you can start talking about maybe becoming a full-time podcaster. And we have several podcasters that we work with. We've had 10 shows that have hit number one in all of Apple. All of them are in the true crime space, but they get millions of downloads per episode and they make a lot of money on their podcasts, you know, good for them right now.

If you want to do that, like that's, that's kind of hard to break into that space at this point. Not saying you can't do it, but it's hard to get a million downloads per episode, right. So, like I said, our friends at Buzzsprout and we say this for some of our clients that are getting, you know, a hundred hundred downloads, uh, 50 downloads per episode, right.

That may not seem like many, but depending on what your business is, that may be those a hundred downloads, maybe worth $10,000 to you. Right. For example, like if we have an attorney or a doctor or something that has a podcast and they get one new client in their niche from their podcast, It's worth like you can't really put a dollar figure on that amount.

Um, unless you're like really measuring that return, but yeah, we have a lot of clients that that's worth it to them. And we even have some like in the, um, the it security space where they're selling a software, selling a product that's worth so much. If they just get one. One conversion from their podcast.

It's worth it for the entire year. And it pays for it for the entire year and their, their sponsors, uh, know that because they're so niche and, and they, they make a lot off their podcasts because of the specific niche that it's in. So I'd say it really depends on kind of what your long-term goal is with the podcast.

If it's a branded show, you probably don't want to sell ads on it because that cheapens your brand. And you, you got to think about how much. How much, um, how much value you're getting from your show to your brand or how much, how much value your show is bringing to your brand? Um, just by having that engaged audience that I was talking about, you know, a room of a hundred people, right?

Well, that's, that's pretty powerful. 

Joseph: [00:36:50] Yeah. There's a, there's a couple of, uh, Important points to address there. And one of them is also just about integrity. Like if I don't even know what ad is being inserted, uh, then it might not fit with the motif that might, might even be something that I disagree with.

You know, it might be a mutually detrimental, uh, A relationship for both sides, not just the podcast, but the advertiser as well. Yeah. And also tying this into something that we talk about a lot in e-commerce is there's, there's a lot of work in the advertising to generate traffic and to get people to come into the store.

And then there's a lot of work into retention. And it's important to hear too, in podcasting, even like you say, in an audience of 50 people or a hundred people, which frankly, I think that's what we're around right now is that each person really matters, which is why I constantly say contact podcasts at Debutify.

We want to hear from you, let us know whatever you got. And by the way, guys contact us podcasts @debutify.com. Come let us know, uh, your, your, your feedback. And would you have. But for smaller podcasts, uh, engagement is tricky. So have you found anything in particular that helps to bridge this gap between the host and the, and the listeners?

Jacob Bozarth: [00:37:57] Sorry, you meant like, rephrase that question sure enough, I guess elaborating on it maybe a little bit. 

Joseph: [00:38:02] So what are some methods that, uh, either you've seen or you can recommend for our hosts to better engage and to really motivate the audience to be more involved in the show.

Jacob Bozarth: [00:38:14] Yeah, that's a great question. I think, um, definitely one way to do that is like, Some sort of a call to action, you know, we have, like, you just, did you, you said engage with us, send us an email, send us your feedback.

Um, even beyond that, I've seen some shows do this really well of, you know, do giveaways or to, um, some sort of a drawing say, Hey, everyone, that leaves us a review is going to, you know, not just, not just gives us five stars, but leaves us a written review with some feedback or why they like the show or they don't like the show.

We're going to be entered into some sort of a drawing or some sort of a giveaway. Another great thing that I've seen. A lot of, a lot of the shows we work with do is they'll do a Q and a episodes. So they may say, Hey, if you have a question for us about this show, you can call into this number, this voicemail box, leave your message or email in, or tweet us, or engage with us in that way.

And then we actually do a whole episode or, you know, a section, uh, just where you're responding to those questions, listener questions. And so I think that's a great way to engage your audience, to engage your listeners. Because if I write in a question naturally, I'm going to tune into your Q and a episode because I want to hear my question either played or read.

So I think that's a great way. Another great thing that we see a lot of our clients do is in social media. And that kind of leads into, you know, marketing and podcast marketing. We have a lot of our, if you're a podcast host, you almost have to be engaged in social media. I'm not a podcast host and I'm not very, very active on social media.

You probably saw that, but you know, you absolutely have to be involved and engaged. I think a lot of, a lot of the hosts that we work with are very active, um, on social media, on Instagram, on Twitter, on Facebook, Tik TOK, all the different platforms. 

Joseph: [00:39:52] Okay, well, that's, that's a valid point and that's something that I'm definitely going to want to take into a personal consideration.

And so with that in mind, uh, I do want to shift into the marketing side of it a little bit more. So one of the things I wanna ask about primarily is, uh, SEO. Now I'm assuming that, I mean, when people set up their website, it's a little more clear as what to do about SEO. So, and I also know that you guys are a big proponent of setting up a podcast website.

Uh, so we'll take that. And the, the broad question is really like counting the host involvement on social media. What is essential for a podcast to be effectively marketing. 

Jacob Bozarth: [00:40:29] Yeah. Great question. Um, so one of the, one big thing that we're a huge proponent of as well would be transcription and or show notes.

Um, so having that written description of your show or that written summary really helps a lot, not just with Google, but also with, with Apple and all the different directories Spotify. Putting your show notes, or at least putting an extended description of the show in those, in those listening directories.

And they all have a place where you can put that in, you know, the show, title, the show description. Um, and I would say, you know, just act, start by just accurately. Giving a summary of the episode, accurately giving a summary of the show under the show listing, um, and with the title and, and yeah, definitely, um, posting those on your, on your website.

So, and then linking back to the different directories. Um, that's another great way you can do that. Um, social media, like you said, is a huge one. Having people share your episodes. And so I would say, you know, the more engaging your content is, the more people are going to share that. So definitely encourage people to share to retweet.

If you can pull clips from your episodes. And you can put them in like an audio gram. So like a short little audio clip. That's maybe a video format that you can put on Instagram or you can post on anywhere. And then people can share that retweet that those are really powerful. I know you, you all do that.

Typically at the beginning of the episode, doing a pull quote, adding that in with some music underneath it, and those are typically more engaging. We also have, um, you can do like, you know, social images, same thing, same concept where you would pull up a quote. Put it on an image and just be able to post it as a, as a picture on social media.

So I know that really helps and being able again, to have people, the ability to share and retweet or requote your, your content is very powerful and definitely, always going to be helpful with that engagement piece. 

Joseph: [00:42:18] I will say, cause I'm observing what, what you're saying right now. And one of the things that I I'll be transparent about is we have our, we have our day debutify presence on social media, but really clicked in that ecomonics could stand to have its own individual presence on social media as well.

Definitely tie tie into the beautify, but that would be a way to, uh, connect the, the show and allow it to stand on its own two legs too. So I would say, uh, for anybody, I guess is kind of in my position where like they're working on a show that is representative of a company, is that the show also needs to have his own foundation too.

So yeah, that I am underlining cause that's really important. 

Jacob Bozarth: [00:42:57] Yeah. Other thing on that note I will say is, you know, you can set up like even a group, uh, and this kind of goes back into your last question about engagement. We had a show that we produce fully in-house. We wrote it and everything back in 2018, I think it was yeah, July, July of 2018. So whenever it released that show, actually we started a Facebook group and it grew to well over like 10,000 very quickly. Um, and so that's, that's another like a discussion group and people can engage in that. People can talk about that. So that's another thing is like, if you can create a community around your podcast where people are talking about your content, where people can ask questions where you can potentially engage, or you get other thought leaders in there that can engage with your audience, that becomes a really powerful tool.

And I know that kind of goes into like, you know, essentially building a tribe around your brand, around your audience. And so that, that's another thing that we've seen a lot of, even several of our clients do is have those different discussion groups, or maybe you have a, a forum online on your, on your website or a discussion board.

Um, but people like to talk about it. People like to talk about episodes. And I think if you can create that community aspect, that's whenever you really see your podcasts, start to grow quickly and gain, gain more and more of an audience, people are talking about it. People are sharing it with their friends and their family, uh, and everyone in, and that's.

That's what we've seen happen on several occasions? Um, not just with our own shows, but with other shows that we work with. 

Joseph: [00:44:21] I totally agree. I, one of the main things that got me into podcasting at the beginning was the, the community aspect, the idea that the host of the show, they all knew each other.

They were friends and they were getting along. And it was, it was great to just listen to them and, you know, feel like I'm sitting in the room while they're having that conversation. And then they opened up for listener mail and one listener ended up asking them for dating advice and they're games, journalists.

And they don't, that was just kinda like random, right. Somebody just asked for dating advice because they trusted them so much. And the results for that advice were so good that they ended up. Branching out. And they did a dating advice podcast for nerds and gamers. So, uh, yeah. Props to them for that it's organic.

Right. These things, they, they, they evolve over time. 

Jacob Bozarth: [00:45:03] Absolutely. Yeah. And I think that's like podcasting is such an intimate forum, you know, form of a medium, right. You're you have the hosts, like in your ear, listening to them. I know for me, I'm a huge, true crime fan podcast. And th the things I like about the shows and arrest step back and think about what, why, what are the reasons why I like the shows that I really, really like, and it's, it's that level of authentic.

Authenticity feeling like I'm there as a part of the investigation, you know, I'm on the edge of my seat with, with the host who's going and knocking on that door of, of the person that's potentially like responsible for the crime. And I feel like I'm there with them. And they're, there's that deep sense of, uh, you just feel like you're, you're along for the ride.

You're, it's, it's a very intimate experience of experiencing that. And so I think that's one of the cool things about podcasting is it's very intimate, medium, intimate form of medium. 

Joseph: [00:45:56] And even though the episode has already been published, I imagine that it still feels quite intense. To open, knock on the door as somebody who might've been a miter.

Absolutely. Oh, well, this thing was uploaded, so I assume that the house is okay, but still it's. 

Jacob Bozarth: [00:46:11] Absolutely. Yeah, yeah, no, I've even been on the other side where I've actually been knocking on the door, holding a microphone as well. And I'll even say, you know, going back and listening to those episodes, I feel like I'm, I'm sitting on the edge of my seat, even though I know, like I'm I'm okay.

Everybody's okay. But it's still creates that sense of that experience of going along and being there. 

Joseph: [00:46:31] Terrific. All right. So there, there's still like a solid chunk of, of content that I, that I want to ask you about a couple of small curiosities. One of them is when, uh, when I was going through the different positions you have on your website, just to see like what roles are being filled in the, in a, in a podcast production company.

Um, what role does, uh, I hope this isn't like, I don't know, but like, for, for, for a sales person, This is something that I'm curious about. Like, is it mostly getting inbound inquiries and trying to onboard people, do salespeople do outbound? Do they go to different companies and try to pitch podcasts?

Jacob Bozarth: [00:47:06] That's a great question. So, you know, we've had a great problem of not having to do any outbound sales at this point. It's all been inbound, warm leads, um, which, you know, again is a great, great problem to have. So right now, Our sales team, they do no outbound sales. It's all, you know, people are scheduling calls with us, learning about what we do, learning about our services, learning about the software we offer.

And that's primarily through SEO, but that's also through referrals. We get a lot of referrals from the clients we work with. Um, we have over 1600 users on our platform. And so, you know, we get people that tell their friends, tell different people at different companies and stuff like that. And we work with, you know, all the way from your hobbyist podcasts or who may talk about anything and everything, you know, whatever they're passionate about golf or, uh, hunting or bringing their own beer or knitting or whatever. That may be all the way to large organizations such as Twitter and DHL and other fortune 500 companies who have podcasts.

So, yeah, that's one of the things, you know, we have kind of a solution for them, whether it's like a full white glove, they need help writing their content. They need help. Figuring out what it is. They need us to actually source the talent for their show all the way to. People who maybe just need a hosting platform or maybe just need editing, you know, basic editing of editing out ums and filler words and all the things you hear me saying in this podcast, right?

Yeah. There's really, we kind of have a solution for everyone and we really kind of have a relation, very relational sales process of where it's like, Hey, we just want to help. Figure out what's the best solution for you. If it's just, Hey, here's some resources on our website, check these out. That's great.

Or if it's, Hey, our services are a good fit. Come on. Let's work together. That's great as well. 

Joseph: [00:48:48] Yeah. I also am willing to throw myself on the Pyre for a second here. I did not realize how much of a stumbler I was, especially for, I think the first chunk of episodes, I would listen to them and I would just like.

I, I know I said this to you already in prerecording, but for our audience's sake though, they know what I'm talking about, where I'll get to a sentence. And then I'm like, I've got to do it again and do it again. Like why now. 

Jacob Bozarth: [00:49:13] If you want to become a better public speaker or just a better speaker in general, definitely start a podcast because that is a hundred percent true.

Anytime you record yourself and then go back and listen to it, you realize how much, how many different filler words and other type of things that you say false starts, all those type of things that, that you don't naturally here. Just in everyday talking. 

Joseph: [00:49:34] Yeah. And he can start to understand people's personality based off like their archetypes.

Uh, you have armors, you have, uh, lip smackers you have, um, I'm a, I'm also a wa I'm a Weller. What's a, what's a Weller. Well, when I answer a question, I always start by saying, well, there's the, you know, wearers and yeah. 

Jacob Bozarth: [00:49:52] It's absolutely, absolutely. Or honestly like, those are the things you pick up on. You're like, Oh, why am I saying that over and over and over.

Joseph: [00:50:02] I'm also an yeah, I'm a, I'm an absolute tear as well. I've said absolutely quite a few times. Cool. Awesome, great, cool. Stuff like that. It's hard even though that this isn't live momentum is so important in making sure that the content comes out. Feeling like it's, it's it's good life, uh, with a lot of flow to it.

Jacob Bozarth: [00:50:20] Absolutely. And that's yeah, not to go off on a rant, but I'm going to, um, that's one of the most important things I think that we see is like, you know, your content is important if your content is really good, but if you're, it's like distracting because you say, you know, or, um, after every other word. We try to remove those distractions and help your content shine.

So no matter how good your content is, if the audio quality is really poor, or if they're distracting things about it, right. People may not listen or they may turn it off, or they may not come back to listen to the episode. So I can't overstate how much, how important. You know, for us, it is to have good audio quality to do post-production to clean it up.

Not saying you have to use resonate recordings, but just take the time to listen to your podcast, to clean it up, to add in some intro and outro music, make sure the levels are consistent throughout. So people aren't having to turn it up and down and do their own mastering. Right? That's important. Those things are important.

And a lot of times people don't think about those things until they start getting those complaints from their listeners, or they see a drop-off in their listeners. And at that point it may be too late. 

Joseph: [00:51:22] This is kind of a sidetrack question, but I was just wondering if you had any recommendations for good, a lav microphones, the ones that clip to the shirt.

Jacob Bozarth: [00:51:29] Yeah. Great question. I know our engineers were just, uh, had that question not too long ago from a client. You know, there, there are several that I'll say. You can get on Amazon that plugged directly into your like smartphone, because if you, you know, if you get one and then you have to get like a transmitter in wireless transmitter, that can be kind of somewhat of a pain and somewhat expensive.

So I would say if you're open to it, just start with like sure makes a, uh, Can't remember the exact model, but they make one that's I think under a hundred dollars. It's just a basic lab light, plug it in, or I'm sorry, you clip it on your, on your shirt and then you plug it directly into your phone. I think they come with different connector types for different types of phones.

So I'd say start there, um, or just do a search on Amazon and there there's a couple other even kind of knockoff models that you can use. Yeah, I could get back with you and you can even add it in the notes. If you want of different models, specific models. If you, if you have a larger budget, if you do have a larger budget and you, you do want to do the transmitter and everything like that, um, that certainly is an option.

Joseph: [00:52:28] Yeah, well, I just don't want to repeat the same mistake I made a couple of years ago where I don't remember if I bought it off eBay, but it was like a four-pack of, uh, lav microphones that were like a dollar 99 each. And it was cool. They each came in their own little satchel. I said, guys, this doesn't work as intended.

And it says, Oh, okay, send it back. We'll give you the refund. I'm like, yeah, it's fine. I'm not gonna get the $4 just lesson learned.

Jacob Bozarth: [00:52:54] Yeah. Uh, yeah, I think it's the, the sheer MVL mobile. That's what's wrong. 

Joseph: [00:53:01] Okay, great. Yeah, I'm going to take that one. Uh, take. Take note of that one, for sure. It's $60. So thank you.

Jacob Bozarth: [00:53:08] Hey, it works well. It comes with the cool app. Yeah. It comes with a cool app too, that you can download so you can see the level and everything like that, and you can upload it directly to wherever you need to straight from their app. So I've used that one before. Um, and, and I can say with confidence, it works well.

You know, it may not be the best sounding lav mic in the world, but it sounds good. And you're going to get a clean and clear recording from it. 

Joseph: [00:53:31] All right. So for the last little bit of time, what I want to do is I just want to ask a couple of high-minded questions just about, you know, the podcasting industry and waters, maybe some predictive questions, some stuff that we're going to see down the line.

So this is one debate that I've been grappling with in my head, um, is between audio and video. And I'm putting my own show on the spot here. By the way I enjoy that this show is an audio only format. I'm not against doing a video show. In fact, We have an idea for a video show that we want to do, like a Facebook live thing.

That's down the line. So my question is what can an audio only show do to make the most out of being audio only? 

Jacob Bozarth: [00:54:08] Yeah, I think one of the things is that engagement we talked about and building that community around your podcast. You know, I think another, another important thing is visualizing verbally, right?

So giving, giving descriptions of what you're seeing or what's, you're talking about, um, and explaining it in a way where, you know, you don't have that visual component. So if you're talking about. Someone you're interviewing and you want to give your listener, uh, an understanding of what they look like.

You know, I'm, I'm interviewing this person and they have long scraggly hair or whatever that means maybe. Right. Um, so I think there's, there's definitely verbal cues, verbal descriptions that a lot of the shows I'll listen to do a really good job of giving you outside of that. Again, I think just building that community around your show.

Having an online presence. Some people like to see, you know, what you look like and that, so if you're on social media or if you have a fan page, or if you have a discussion group or something like that, maybe give those, those things you talk about. Right? That's one of the reasons why I think show notes are so important and having a website for your podcast is so important because at the end of your show, you can say, Hey, all the resources we talked about, all the, all the links we mentioned.

Anything, we talked about this map or whatever it may be. We're going to post that to our show note page, where you can go, you can see that you can see what we were talking about and that, that serves your, the primary purpose of that is serving your listeners as well. But the secondary benefit of that as you get traffic coming to your website and you have an opportunity to share other resources with them.

Right? So, yeah, I think that's, that's definitely a win-win is having a website, having those show notes or even a transcription where people, if they want to go and read that they can. 

Joseph: [00:55:51] And a couple of other things too, that I wanted to, uh, raise as well in the. Incentive versus making it a video show. Cause I think a lot of that applies to is that, you know, we can do more fine editing.

Um, we can, I think if you did the fine editing for a video that we were to do for an audio show, it would come across as jarring. Cause he was, he like cuts in the video. People will be like all over the place. 

Jacob Bozarth: [00:56:12] Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We have a lot of clients that we work with that do audio and video, and they always ask, you know, a lot of people always ask us, Hey, can we use the same audio just from the video?

Or is that completely different service or different product? And the answer is usually it's a completely different service. For her process, because like you said, we can't do the fine tooth editing that we can do on the audio only. I'm sorry, on the video that we can on the audio only because you'd have a ton of jump cuts and stuff like that.

With those editing out every arm or filler word or whatever that may be now. I mean, Maybe you're going to go into this next, but video is, you know, we have a lot of clients, like I said, that use video as well. And one of the reasons for that is YouTube is like one of the, I think the second highest, or maybe the highest like search engine right behind Google, um, obviously owned by Google.

And so a lot of our clients will put their podcasts out on YouTube. As just an additional directory, essentially for people to listen. And I have people, I have some friends, a lot of people that I ask them, where did they listen to her podcast? And they say YouTube. Uh, and so some people like that, they like to be able to watch that interview or, you know, listen on YouTube or they search on YouTube and find that.

So by all means, I think it is a great way to reach an additional audience by just distributing your show on YouTube. 

Joseph: [00:57:29] Great. Great, great that you brought that up. So me, I will say that because I'm in my apartment most of the time now YouTube is the single fastest way to get to content. I just open up the app and the algorithm knows what it is that I'm looking for.

And 99 times out of a hundred, and in this context, I'm not actually like looking to engage visually. Um, but because I don't have YouTube premium, if I close the window, it stops playing and it used to not do that by the way, they actually re they reversed that it used to not do that. I remember on my Blackberry, uh, my Blackberry curve, I would, I would lock the screen and I can still listen to it.

And they got rid of that. Cause I think they realized, well, come on, it's a video platform. If people are going to do this, they need to pay us. So, uh, touche YouTube. But, um, and, and then again, in full transparency, I'm asked legitimately for ecomonics stake, which is for this audio show. We make a video version of it.

It was like the best way that we can, um, turn it into a video. Short. I mean, obviously we're not putting our faces on it, and then we're going to put a few videos that we have right now, but like, you know how to get the audio to make the most out of being onto a video platform. 

Jacob Bozarth: [00:58:35] Yeah. We've seen more and more people do videos, especially with the log towns and everyone going remote. And I think that's one of the cool things is like with the zoom, with the other technologies, Riverside FM has one right now that they have audio only recording platform, but also a video option as well to record 4k video through your webcam. Or if you have 4k capability with your camera.

You know, whereas historically, to record a video, right? The audio platform is such, there's such a low barrier to entry to start audio only podcast, get you a microphone. We talked about all that earlier, the basic equipment. Whereas with video it's like used to, you have to go get a video camera, set up a studio, the correct lighting, that type of thing.

Whereas now you can just simply record a zoom call and you can turn that into a podcast. Right. And you have that video component, right. It might not be. The best video production in the world, but there's a lot of things even we can do in post to help with that. And, and again, you know, it's very easy to, to record a video podcast and just double that.

Right. For all. I know you could be recording the, our video right now in the background and it would, we could do this as a video podcast. 

Joseph: [00:59:42] Yeah. Um, but um, more specifically let's say that, and this isn't hypothetical, cause this is, I was actually trying to figure some things out is we've already produced the audio and we don't have any attention to adding like a our zoom call here to it. Um, is there any thing that we can do, like having one of those, um, those wavelengths on it, or is there any, have you seen anybody put just the audio to the point where there's actually no video to watch? 

Jacob Bozarth: [01:00:05] Yeah, we do have some clients that do that if just putting a still image up there or, you know, even just as simple as their cover art.

Right. You can put that up there with your picture on there. Like you all do for your cover art for each episode. That is an option. I will say, you know, if you're going to post to YouTube, You can certainly do that. Um, but I would say now it's so simple to record video, just do it just to record the video as well.

And then we can turn that into, you know, someone engaging. We can add some lower thirds, different transitions. You can even put up different visuals throughout. Right? Whenever we are talking about a specific microphone, we could pop that up on the screen or whatever that may be. So yeah, there's, there's a lot you can do with the post video.

Um, and yeah, you can certainly turn it into like just a long form audio gram. Where it's simply video the entire show, you know, it's audio only, but you just have a, it's a video file essentially that you post to YouTube. So that's another way just to distribute it out. And we actually have that for the show that we produced internally culpable, and it has a lot of listens on YouTube and it's simply just the art design for each episode and just the audio.

That's all it is. 

Joseph: [01:01:12] A lot of options. It's definitely a lot of options. Okay. It actually ended up being more practical than high-minded. So let me, but this one definitely is high-minded. So what I'm going to do for you is I'm going to ask the question and then I'm going to give you my answer to it so that it gives you your new a second to like, kind of like get the answer process in your mind.

If I don't ask you this question, I'm going to be doing myself a disservice because I have brought this up to other people who are not part of the podcasting, uh, industry, so to speak. Um, but me, I have had an issue with the term podcast in the past. Um, mainly because it, so Osos, it's still associated with Apple being the Genesis of podcasting and to the point where I.

I think the term podcast is holding the medium back. Um, now if you disagree with that, I'm, I'm willing to hear that, but would you, if you can call it something else or would you just say, well, this is actually just radio, internet, radio. Uh, like I feel it is. Um, would you do that? And now, and again, give me a second to think.

Cause I want to give you my answer. And one revelation that I came to is the idea of decoupling the pod part of it from Apple, but more thinking about the idea that pods are some enclosed space that people are in and they're casting from their pods. So you're in your pod, I'm in my closet, I'm in my pod.

And so in that sense, that is where I visualize the pod side of it. And I think that's much more general than. Apple, which is a big player, but it's only one player. It would be like saying Amazon is all there is to e-commerce and there are a lot, but they're not the whole thing. 

So what, um, I'm curious what the exact question is going to be, just so I can, yeah, yeah, yeah.

The question ended up being kind of like buried in there. Uh, so would you call it something else? Are you happy with podcasting? Do you feel that the name is, uh, is doing us more good than bad? Or have you ever thought anything along these lines? 

Jacob Bozarth: [01:03:04] Yeah. That's I mean, definitely have thought about that. And I think that's, that's a really, really good observation.

Good question. So the one thing I will say is like, I think, I think the one thing we're seeing is so many other major players coming into this space that, like you said, whereas initially it was primarily Apple, right? That was the most important. It seemed like for people, they cared about that the most, if you were a podcaster, you cared about the Apple top charts, you cared about, you know, your podcasts being an Apple.

If you're an Apple. You were good. Whereas now, like there Spotify, there are other major players coming out or people are listening to Amazon, you know, all these different directories. And so I think seeing that more and more in some ways, At least for me. And like you said, Apple becomes less and less of a player in the space, or at least more of an equal player rather than the main player.

So, I mean, I think we've talked about that before and even thought through that of like, you know, do you change the name to like audio casts or, um, like you said, internet radio or whatever that may be. I think that would be really hard in my mind just because, you know, that is the name. And so I think. In my mind, the more the industry matures and develops and grows, the word podcast, uh, becomes less and less and less associated with Apple because I haven't even thought about that in probably a year now.

Even like, Oh, pod. Yeah. That refers to, to apples, you know, iPod or, and, uh, yeah, so the more, the more I think about like, whenever I think about podcasts, I don't. I personally don't think about Apple or apples, not what immediately comes to mind. So I don't know. I don't know if I would say that. I think it's necessarily holding, holding it back.

I will say at times I've been disappointed at like, How much, how little it seems that Apple cares about the podcast industry. Um, and I think they, you know, are really missing out on a huge, huge opportunity. And I think it's really encouraging to see some of the other players really pouring their resources into, and it really doubling down on the technology and the platforms and what else going into it.

So. I don't know. It's really interesting. I mean, I think it's, it's still somewhat of a young, medium, but I think we are seeing more and more major players coming into this space. Um, we've had some. Large film, uh, production houses coming into the space, reaching out to us to want to work with us and whatnot.

And so I think we're just going to continue to see that. And so I think, uh, yeah, there's a, there's a huge opportunity still to get into the space and to make a name for yourself. Um, but I think it's the more and more it goes mainstream. That window will be closing more and more.

Joseph: [01:05:42] Well, that is a, that's a fantastic observation.

So, yeah, I, I thank you for weighing in on that. I mean, that's a, there's a, definitely a back and forth that we can have there, but we're so close to them. Yeah. Yeah. 

All right. So I got one more question for you. This one, just for fun. At some point, most people think it'd be funny to do a podcast, a bunch, a bunch of friends sitting around shooting the breeze like you want to be personally around, and there's probably weed involved.

You're like, yo, we're so funny. This conversation should be a podcast by any chance. Do you know of any shows with this premise that are actually pretty good? I know it's kind of a hard one, but I just wanted to throw it out there just in case.

Jacob Bozarth: [01:06:18] Um, man, I feel, I feel bad because I, I feel like we probably have some shows.

We work on that, that have that premise. I have to get back with you on that one. Yeah. I mean, all right. 

Joseph: [01:06:31] Well, we can, uh, these, these are released like sometime after they're recorded. So yeah, if you get back to us all inserted afterwards, I'm super curious about this. I would love, I would ma I would love to have, like, one of those just on my, on my radar. So then that way, anytime, I feel like just sitting in on a conversation, a bunch of stoners or whatever. 

Jacob Bozarth: [01:06:50] Yeah, yeah, yeah. We've definitely had some very, very interesting shows. Like I could, I could definitely pull up some of those and that could be a whole nother episode of just sharing different, uh, different, different shows who've worked on, uh, that are like, I mean, are our client base is so diverse and just kind of all over the place, but yeah, they're there, it's a lot of fun. That's honestly, one of the things that I enjoy is getting to experience in here. All these different shows, all these different topics, all these different, you know, perspectives and stories and messages from these different people.

It's, it's really cool and, uh, really blessed to get to experience that. So, I mean, yeah, the one I can think of that would be the closest would be like a Joe Rogan experience, you know, that. 

Joseph: [01:07:36] Yeah, actually, now that you say that it is pretty close to that. Yeah. That's definitely the one that I can, that comes closest to mind of, of that concept.

Um, that is a high bar to set. 

Jacob Bozarth: [01:07:51] Yeah. Yeah, for sure. 

Joseph: [01:07:53] All right. Well, fantastic. This was a, this was a terrific episode, Jacob. I can't thank you enough for being here. Uh, I want to give you the floor one last time, just to run through how people can reach out to you and throw a couple of a show recommendations in there too.

I know you mentioned your true crime shows before, but uh, just run them past us again and then last but not least, if you have any other parting words of wisdom you'd like to share, this is a, this is the time to do it. 

Jacob Bozarth: [01:08:17] Yeah. Well, thank you so much for having, having me on, it's been a pleasure to get to talk about podcasting, which obviously I'm very passionate about.

Yeah. I'll say just kind of parting words of wisdom would be, you know, if you're thinking about starting a podcast, I would say, do it, you know, quit thinking about it and do it. There's no better time to do it. And I think that certainly, like I said, that window of opportunity is potentially, you know, closing in on, on.

Just being able to reach, being able to kind of create a voice for yourself. Um, there's no better time to start it than now. I love the saying that 80% out the door is better than a hundred percent in the drawer. And that's, that's so true. You're never going to, there's never going to be a better time to just get it out there.

Um, and it's never going to be a hundred percent just ship it, get it out there and get the message out there and no better time than now. I've never heard that saying before. There you go. Yeah. Well, I love that saying, and I think that's so true, not just with podcasting, but really any creative, creative, medium or creative outlet.

Um, but I think it's also true with business. A lot of times you can sit around and try to perfect something until the end of the day. But the reality is, is like, it's never going to be perfect and you got to get it out there, you know, just, just ship, right. You always have to be shipping to some extent.

Um, and, and I, I encourage my team to do that, you know, Hey, just let's get it out there. We can sit around and perfect it all day, but like, let's get that blog post out there. Let's get that video out there. Let's get this podcast out there. Um, and, and that's, that's really true. Yeah, show recommendations.

Like I said, I'm a big, true crime fan. So I really enjoy a lot of the shows who work on actually up and vanished, uh, was, was one of the one I referred to earlier in the show about that helps solve the 11 year old cold case. We haven't listened to that. Uh, season. One of that is phenomenal. Uh, payne does just a great job of investigating different murders of like that.

He actually has another new one that I'm currently listening to called dead and gone. Um, which is pretty cool. It's like some different crimes around. Oh, my goodness. I'm blanking on anyways. Uh, yeah, it's, it's a really good show. Definitely. Listen to that one. Yeah. Some, I'm trying to think. Some other shows that I enjoy listening to, if you haven't listened to a Dax Shepard's armchair expert, I really enjoy that one.

Um, he actually has a, has a episode with a podcast or a journalist in New Zealand, David farrier that we're currently working on. It's a really good episode. Um, and they actually did kind of a spin off show. Um, I'm blanking on the name of that one as well. I'm terrible with rumor names. But yeah, I mean, anything you can check out our website.

We have, we list a lot of the shows that we work on, on there as well. And then culpable is the show that we produced internally back in 2018. Um, so definitely check, check out culpable. Um, you'll actually hear my voice on there and doing some investigating on there as well. Yeah, you can find this@resinaterecordings.com.

We're on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook at resonate record. Um, so definitely check us out there. Um, again, you know, no matter where you're at, if you're just thinking about starting a podcast or maybe you have one, we have a ton of great resources on our website on video, different videos on our YouTube channel, different blog posts on different topics and everything like that in between.

So however we can help, um, we would love to help that are, again, our mission is to make podcasts in as easy as possible. And it can often seem overwhelming whenever you first look at it. And you think about what you're going to talk about, all the different technical aspects of the different voices out there that tell you, you need this and that and that, and that and that before you can start.

Um, and so we really exist to kind of remove all those technical pieces and, and just make it as simple as possible for you to share your message. 

Joseph: [01:11:48] So I just want to say one last thing about my own, uh, experience. Like the very, very first time that I ever turned on a recording was in college. I rented a, I think it was a boss sounded of a device.

Uh, I, and I rented out a room and I invited, um, everybody in my class. Uh, but. Well, I guess everybody was busy. One guy, he agrees to do it. So I turned on the recording and I say, Oh, welcome to a community cast. Uh, Tyler, it's good to have you here and tell us this grade. And then I just blanked. I just sat there for like, I had no idea what I was doing at that point on.

And then Tyler, he started asking me questions and then we got the ball rolling and yeah, it, it, it, it can be overwhelming. Um, so definitely have a couple of questions, a couple of talking points, ready to go before starting the episode. But the journey is so much more fascinating when you look back and you see of all of these things that have happened.

So absolutely it's totally a journey worth taking. 

Jacob Bozarth: [01:12:45] Absolutely. Yeah. And that's one of the beautiful things about podcasting is it's so unique, you know, and it's so customizable. You can pivot, you can make it, represent your personality. You know, if you, if you want to have detailed notes with all the questions written out, you can do that.

Or if you want to have a manuscript, we have some clients that do that. Um, and so that's one of the. Cool things about podcasting is you can really, you know, mold it to reflect you and to serve you and how it reflects your personality. 

Joseph: [01:13:13] Terrific. All right, listeners, that is everything that we've got for you today.

Hope you enjoy this. Uh, I know I have, uh, Jacob, I, I, I hope do a joint this as well. I'm just, uh, I'm I've been gushing nonstop since it started. And so I got to go put a lid on this. All right, listeners. Thank you so much, Jacob. 

Jacob Bozarth: [01:13:30] Thank you as well. 

Joseph: [01:13:31] And we will check in soon.

Thanks for listening. You might've found this show on many number of platforms, Apple podcasts, Spotify, Google play, Stitcher, or right here on to Debutify. Whatever the case, if you enjoy this content and want to help us thrive, please take a few moments to leave a review on Apple podcasts or wherever you think is best.

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