One of the newer concepts I had formed for my own view of the world is the idea of bedrock, similar to “rock bottom” but in a positive sense, if one fears being at their lowest point, then one should raise that point. With this in mind, our talk with marketing extraordinaire John Crestani explores the relationship between our place in the world relative to those above and below us, and addresses the very human fear of elevating ourselves at the risk of ending up somewhere lower. John’s particular innovative approach, in addition to making the most of our digital industry, has also paid great respect to what was prior established, seeking guidance from those who paved the way and the methods they used to get there. More specifically, those who retired and aren't necessarily being sought out for knowledge by other innovators or heck even a show like ours and using television to seek a market relevant this very instant.
Born in 1987, John Crestani has accomplished a lot in his twenty-nine years. After a number of years of trial-and-error of building his internet business, Crestani finally managed to create a multi-million dollar business, met his wife, and travel the world. His family now lives on a small ranch in Malibu California, where he continues to grow his company and develop software, from an extremely customer-centric approach, based upon the guidance of his advisor, ex-Slack CMO Bill Macaitis.
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John Crestani: [00:00:00] If you look up how to start a business and you take advice from a random blog that shows up first, some website that does content. That's not, you're not necessarily going to get the meat and potato. It's harmful for people to take business advice from somebody who's never started a business and is just being negative. It's tricky but who you take advice from is so critical. Um, and it's something I spend a huge deal of time figuring out for myself.
Joseph: [00:00:39] You're listening to Ecomonics, a Debutify podcast. Your resource for one of the kind of insights into the world of e-commerce and business in the modern age. This is Joseph. I'll be presenting a wealth of industry knowledge from interviews with successful business people and our own state-of-the-art research. Your time is valuable, so let's go.
One of the newer concepts I had formed from my own view of the world is the idea of a bedrock. Similar to rock bottom, but positive. If one fear is being at their lowest point, then one should raised that point. With this in mind, our talk with marketing extraordinary John Crestani explores the relationship between our place in the world, relative to those above and below us and addresses the very human fear of elevating ourselves at the risk of ending up somewhere lower. John's particular innovative approach, in addition to making the most of our digital industry has also paid great respect to what was prior established. Seeking guidance from those who paved the way and the methods they use to get there. More specifically, those who retired and aren't necessarily being set up for their knowledge by other innovators, or heck even a show like ours and also using television to seek a market relevant this very instant.
John Crestani it is good to have it here on Ecomonics, how are you doing today? How are you feeling?
John Crestani: [00:01:56] Dude, pretty good. Pretty good. Just got back from, uh, doing stuff with my personal trainer and, uh, had a knee injury. So working on recuperating it.
Joseph: [00:02:07] Did you, um, get the, did you have the personal trainer prior to that, or was that somebody you picked up to help you with that recovery?
John Crestani: [00:02:12] Uh, a little bit of that and a little bit of, because I'm getting old now, I'm like 33 years old.
Joseph: [00:02:21] Yeah. I'm I'm 31. I do take, I took pride in like the first 10 gray hairs that's sprouted, but now they're starting to develop on mass and they're forming a union up there. So, you know, over time they're becoming a little bit less appreciated, but yeah, I'll do my best to grow into it.
So first question, uh, this is the Ecomonics, uh, tradition. And I am, it's always great to be able to look into what my guests are doing and see what they're up to. And you certainly have a lot to bring to the table. So, uh, take it away. Tell us who you are and what do you do?
John Crestani: [00:02:52] Sure. So my name is John Crestani.
I'm a running a software and a training, uh, online training company. We do, uh, you know, my business, I have two people working for me. We do roughly $6 million per year. We are on TV every night, uh, late night infomercials. So that's how we get our initial customers in is where, uh, we're paying all the TV companies, um, you know, like a hundred thousand a week or whatever to, uh, get advertising space.
And then we are selling stuff on that advertising space. And the goal is to make more money from our customers and from the sale of our software, then that we can. And, um, the goal that we're working towards is, uh, we are high, you know, we're, we're working towards finding product market fit in, uh, software. So. Um, and, uh, so I'm just hiring a lot of tech people, data engineers, uh, developers right now to help us figure that out.
Joseph: [00:03:59] Excellent. So I, I'm going to get to question two, which is just about, you know, your evolution. I know your backstory about how, um, you know, your, the, the agency you work for. Uh, so I want to hear that story, but I got to stop on, um, you guys being on TV because I, we have all the people that I've talked to, typically it's about the transitioning into the more contemporary. Once in a while, I get to talk to somebody who has their hands in are more classic mediums. Uh, lately I talked to somebody who's big on retail and in store. So what was the, the, the drive to find this advertising space and on television, and just to make sure that this was a viable return on investment.
John Crestani: [00:04:39] Great question. So, I mean, what I view my role as in, uh, just being an entrepreneur is really, it's just pattern recognition. It's, you know, once, once, once you, you know, you know, we can get people to do anything. We can hire people to do anything, but, uh, you know, as an entrepreneur, we need to see where things are going, where the puck is going, because we need to skate there to meet it.
Um, and, uh, what I saw happening I'd started, uh, when I started, uh, my info product business, because I started teaching people how to do marketing a few years ago. And that's how a lot of people know me, you know, a bunch of people that follow me on YouTube and all that stuff now I've seen me on TV, et cetera.
Um, but I had started in 2016, 17, advertising on YouTube to reach people. I'd pay YouTube and then I'd sell things to make money. Um, now on YouTube, I started and I was paying for each person to see my ad. I was paying two to 3 cents. Okay. Now over time, over the course of a few years, and what I saw, you know, towards the end of 2019, was that my costs had gone up from spending 2 cents to reach a person to 28 cents to reach a person.
And that was driven largely by the fact that the, this, this training industry, um, this industry for people wanting, you know, some sort of training and some sort of like self-employed career or whatever. Um, just blew up in that time. People call them gurus, uh, you know, online gurus, real estate gurus, there's stock trading gurus, and they all advertise on YouTube now.
So I went from a marketplace of, it was like me, Ty Lopez, and maybe a dozen other people advertising on YouTube, uh, in my, in my space to there being about 25,000 people in 2020. And I just kind of knew I saw where things were going. And the other thing I felt uncomfortable with was because of this increased cost, uh, that was just destroying, you know, my business margins. Um, what I'd also, what, what, what also came with that was because of this increased competition. You increasingly got bad actors. Um, people that would in order to make back their cost of advertising, they would do marketing in a hyper aggressive non-compliant way, borderline financial fraud. And in some cases, just pure financial fraud, um, in order to make back the cost of advertising.
So I didn't feel comfortable with where I saw things going, and I didn't want to necessarily fight that battle. Um, so what I, because there's 25,000 people right? And they're all just hungry wolves and there's, you know, it's the wild West. Um, so, but I saw TV and I knew TV was a proven, a proven medium for reaching people, obviously, but somehow everybody in my industry and what's called the business opportunity industry had forgotten about TV.
So I said, I said, well, I know it works. There's no competition. And then on YouTube, I'm dealing with, you know, tons of comp, why don't I just try TV? And, uh, people have more money on TV. It's an older demographic than YouTube. So I just, I said, you know, and I had a buddy around me who also said, hey, you know, you want to do a TV ad with me, um, quarter million dollars. Do you have a quarter million dollars lying around? I said, you know, yeah, I do. And yeah, I'm interested in doing TV advertising. So I took that, um, uh, I took it seriously and I launched a few TV ads, uh, until we got profitable. And, um, here we are today and it's a pretty good space to be in having no competition. It's kind of crazy.
Joseph: [00:08:54] Yeah. Well, I mean, I certainly know competition, uh, in, in regards to your space. I don't know exactly what time the infomercials are on, I guess what you said, like a late night. So I haven't turned it into a late night infomercial in some time.
John Crestani: [00:09:06] Yeah. Midnight to 8:00 AM.
Joseph: [00:09:08] Yeah. And at the last time I tuned into, I was watching TV that late. Um, it was. Oh man, it was, it was a while ago. It was those ads where you would, I see the pictures of people on the beach and have a phone call for a good time. That was like the last of a rotation I have of it, which does lead me to what I think is a, is a fair question here about, um, cause you, you say that it's a proven method and I think television is certainly a proven medium, but I think the perspective on, um, infomercials is, uh, precarious.
So in your experience, what infomercials or what ads at you had modeled a previously before you got there? Did you look at it as a metrics of success? And conversely, if you'd seen wins that went awry, I'd like to hear those too.
John Crestani: [00:09:51] Great question. Great question. Um, uh, and it's a great question because you're assuming that, uh, and obviously, you know, something about marketing. You're assuming that I modeled my infomercial after others, which I did 100%. In fact, I looked at the top three info, uh, sorry, will I, I looked at the top three business opportunity infomercials closely, but for about a dozen, I literally just, I downloaded them and I would just watch him.
And I would write down every single word, every single sentence, um, uh, who was speaking every sentence of, of, of, of about a dozen different infomercials in my space to model myself after them. And in fact, the script that I wrote for my infomercial was very similar, like just, you know, like take, take another infomercial and just change out a few words.
Um, uh, and that's what I did. Um, another way that I validated that infomercials were an effective form of advertising in my industry was I actually reached out to every single person who had run a business opportunity infomercial. I figure, what do I have to lose? Right. So many folks are scared to do outreach, whether it's to, you know, whether it's for sale or marketing or for hiring, or for people are just so scared of cold outreach nowadays.
And that's something I don't really understand night. I encourage everyone to always do cold outreach, um, because it's oftentimes the fastest way to get to where you're going. And, uh, in this case, I reached out to a bunch of people who had successful infomercials who had made tens or even hundreds of millions of dollars.
And, uh, one of them got back to me in fact, sorry to, um, I had conversations with, and they told me they were, they were retired from, uh, the industry and they just told me everything. They were tired, they were retired and they just said, hey, yeah. And they told me every number that I be at, where I should be advertising.
And it wasn't hard. I didn't have to pay anybody, anything. I just had to not be scared. And reach out to the people that would have the fastest way in and for them, the benefit for them and talking to me was they understood they, they, they were in the business of marketing because they loved it. So talking to somebody else who was, who is proactive, who's doing interesting things in marketing, um, uh, and was coachable. And I think that's a very important thing is just being coachable and, uh, because they didn't need to spend their time with me. They didn't need to go to lunch or spend hours on calls with me, but for them I'm such an enthusiastic marketer that people, people love that and they want to be surrounded.
They get the enthusiasm. So they'll spend the time with me for free and give me tips that will, that have been making me millions of dollars. So it's, it's it's um, yeah, I'm really fortunate or lucky if you want to call it that.
Joseph: [00:13:13] Well, so one observation that I would say, and I can speak to this just from my own position, you know, definitely in like the, uh, setting, uh, which is that reaching out to somebody, um, the concern isn't that they might not answer because that's just okay when nothing happens. The concern is actually if they do answer and then I don't have maybe like good enough questions ready, or I'm not going to I'm I'm about to, um, turn this interaction with them. Um, and I'm going to get like a bronze metal out of it when I could get gold or platinum.
So I think an own lack of our own self-drive and our own clear direction. I think that might actually be the reason why sometimes like a successful contact might actually be the reason that people are scared and not necessarily, you know, a rejection or even nothing.
John Crestani: [00:14:02] Yeah. And I I'd agree with that. And I'd say if you go even deeper down a lot of, a lot of success with business has to do with the, the confidence, um, and the belief. Uh, and, um, but belief is great when the times are good, but it's not good when the times are bad. I'd say faith is a really powerful word in my vocabulary because faith is about having faith in what you're doing doesn't just permeate when the times are good, but when the times are bad, that is when faith is most important.
Um, so having faith is, is super big. Uh, I, I would say, you know, just calm, you know, as I said before, confidence and furthermore everything I do, I do with a sense of urgency. Um, I'm not just like, hey man, do you have time sometime? You know, maybe we can kind of talk, look, I'm, I'm a fly. You know, I'm flexible your schedule. When I do things, you know, I'm, you know, when I'm looking to talk to somebody, I, I reached out to a few billionaires, uh, earlier this week because I'm trying to hire a data engineer right now.
But, um, but the way I reach out has a time constriction or somewhat of a time constriction, I'm saying, hey, I'm hiring a data engineer right now. And I just wanted to say, thank you so much for your interview. Now, these guys are billionaires. They probably won't see my message, but the point that it's timely.
It has some relation to time means that if they are going to respond, they'll respond sometimes sooner rather than later. And, uh, so I'd say what, what, I don't know, I'm coming up with this on the spot, but I'd, uh, I'd say confidence, faith and urgency, um, is something I bring to really all of my relationships.
Joseph: [00:16:05] Well, one thing I like to, to share into that, uh, either this was a revelation that somebody had said to me about the difference between motivation and determination whereas if someone doesn't have the will to do something and they say, well, I'm not motivated today. And I've, I mean, even just last week, I'm sure I've said that a number of times.
Uh, but when somebody said that, that determination, that really set in, because it made me realize that if I have a goal. I'm going to get to this goal and nuts to be too hyperbolic or die trying. This is what I'm going to do. I see this in my future. I'm going to make it to that point.
John Crestani: [00:16:39] Yeah. Yeah. I th it, it, where it gets really difficult is we have a range.
We have a normal range of emotional comfortability, and whenever things go out, stop, some people have narrower range of some people have wider ranges. And whenever we, you know, as entrepreneurs, especially, or people starting our own businesses, get outside of that range of comfortability and anything can do it.
It can be that you just spent a thousand dollars advertising your new product that you came up with on Amazon and nobody's buying it and you lost all that money. And you're stuck with all this inventory and you don't have any money left. And you, you, you feel like the world is imploding because you can't continue on with your business anymore.
Or another thing that could take you out of your range of emotional comfortability is, you know, your dog got sick. Another thing could be your boss, yelled at you. Another thing could be that your mom wants you home for Thanksgiving. And, uh, you know, and, and you want to start an online store and take advantage of black Friday, but you have to kind of give that time up too, because your mom was guilt tripping you about another Thanksgiving or something.
Um, all of those things take us outside of our range of comfortability. And when we get outside of our range of comfortability, all of these things breakdown, um, you know, the, the determination, the enthusiasm, the optimism, all the motivational quotes that people are reading to try to push them through starting their own business and getting, and, and that is where all the problems happen.
Imagine a stock price for a second. Stock prices when they crash, they don't, it's not it's, it's not a slow, downward trend. It's like a spike. And that's what happens when we're starting a business. It's like, you know it, you know, it's, it's, it's the same thing with like breaking up with a girlfriend or a boyfriend.
But when you stop, when you stop a business, when you break up with a business that you're trying to accomplish, you go back to starting from zero. So many people do that, that one thing that takes them outside of their level of emotional comfortability, boom, they're back to zero. Um, and that's, that is the thing more entrepreneurs I believe, need to be aware of, uh, because I haven't made my money from, you know, good roles in the craps table. I've made, I've made my money from the follow-through. I've made my money from the term. It hasn't been the decisions as much as it's been the follow through. Um, and the long-term follow through that's that's made me, um, I could use so many examples, but you know, we are living with the internet.
It is exponential. Uh, everything is exponential and our brains are trained to think linearly. Okay, you, you do work for an hour. You get paid 10 bucks, you work another hour, you get paid 20 bucks. So you, you know, over time, your salary goes up over time. It's linear progression our brains. Aren't trained to think in what the world is made for nowadays.
If you're starting an internet or a stock trading business which is the returns on internet and stock trading businesses are exponential. Uh, it happens exponentially. It happens super fast. You go from 1000 subscribers one month for, you know, you work six months to get a thousand subscribers on YouTube, but then the next six months you get a hundred thousand.
That's not a linear progression. So it's so unnatural for us to think this way. That's why it's gotta be. That's why we've got to be even more aware of what's actually going on in our brain and our emotional state. And this even goes back to Eastern philosophy, which is know thyself. You know, know, know yourself before you can affect others and like the samurai, one of the books, I highly recommend, sorry, I'm just going on a huge mind dump rant here.
But samurai master. Samurai were taught to master their own mind and their own body before they wielded it as a weapon on other people. Um, you know, it's the same with many religions, which is know yourself and understand. Your own emotional States, your own patterns, your own self-sabotaging behaviors first.
And that is the most important.
Joseph: [00:21:46] That's a, that's a lot to take in. Definitely a lot of threads to open up there.
And the one thing that I wanted to make sure that we got to was your, what was your backstory and how you got to this point? And I think it'd be great to also tie in, um, using, you know, you can use yourself as an example of your own emotional awareness and how you got and how you can, and after you do that, I also wanted to touch on too the malleability of this, especially with like the clients that maybe you've, uh, you've worked with, the people who've reached out to you for coaching and how much of it is understanding what is crystallized versus what is liquid and what can actually be expanded and expanded upon. So, uh, so backstory how you, you know, evolve to become the free version that you are today. And, um, your own emotional journey within all of that.
John Crestani: [00:22:39] Yeah. And everything's just my opinion, obviously, you know, but, but this is, what's worked for me, but, um, you know, I spend a lot of time. Uh I'll I'll generally spend an hour each night or every other night in my bathtub. I put on, I turn off all the lights.
I turn on Aaliyah candle. I like organics. And, um, I, I just noticed my thoughts and sometimes I'll even do this in my chair if I'm feeling anxious, um, like a lot of entrepreneurs I'm, uh, anxious and I'm impatient and sometimes impetuous and, uh, what I've. And I, but I know, but knowing that about myself allows me to take different actions.
So, because I'm impetuous, I wait 24 to 48 hours before making an important decision that's gonna affect us. Okay. Um, or course, you know, of course change. Right. We're working on software and I wanna add this one feature and I say, okay, hold back, John. Let's wait on it. Uh, um, knowing I'm, um, knowing I'm impatient.
I, uh, you know, one of the things I tend to do is whenever I have some free time, I find ways to just gobble up that time. Oh, I'm going to hire a new person, or I'm going to go on a, I'm going to go start this, this project over here. I'm going to, Oh. And I create longterm and nursery for myself. So I. So even when I'm bored and I'm like, I need to do more stuff.
Uh, I try, I try to hold myself back from putting too much on my plate and overloading myself and holding back my business later. Um, so those are things I do, but I guess it's noticing my thoughts. I think of them like bubbles and I don't necessarily trust every thought that goes through my head because I know two thirds of my brain are not necessarily conscious. So, and those two thirds of my brain creep into my neocortex to make me be like, ah, this was a horrible business. Ah, you know, I should not take that risk a quarter million dollars, could end up with $0. I could buy another house with that. You know, like these are the things, you know, and I have to look at things with a logical conscious point of view. So that's what I do there. Um, everything is malleable, I would say. Um, you know, like at the end of the day, there are no concrete maxims, but you do see trends and patterns. When you watch a lot of interviews, I've probably watched PR I'm probably closing in on like a thousand.
Uh, it definitely hundreds of interviews with, uh, Senta millionaires, billionaires and DECA millionaires. But then what was your third question?
Joseph: [00:25:31] Oh, well, and then it was also about, well, there was, there was two other things which is, you know, we wanted to hear about like, um, you know, your, your job experience and the job that had, uh, really been the catalyst for a lot of this, which is kind of like it's getting into its own subject and of itself.
So we'll, we'll, we'll pin that for a second, but it's also about how you've identified this and other people, too, people that you're working with. And, um, if there has been a journey for them to condition themselves emotionally so that, you know, they're ready to take on what it is that they've come to you for in the first place.
John Crestani: [00:26:03] Yeah. So. I, uh, I've personally mentored people within, uh, my company. This is years ago when I had it in house media buyers. Um, and, but I I'd say I'm pretty personal. I pretty hands-on with mentorship of the students that go through my various programs. I have a number now. Uh, we've had, I don't know, we've had like, over 30,000 people, uh, sign up for programs of, uh, uh, various training programs of mine.
And I, I always do every week. I do a webinar with, um, with one group or the other with my students for multiple hours. So I, I stay, I always want to stay pretty hands-on to figure out what's, um, how the training is actually passing through, um, what I've seen in terms of, and yeah, I I'd say it's good.
You're asking that question because I see who's successful. I see who's not successful. It's very, it's very evident to me. Um, I'll, I'll go over a few things. So people who have more success starting their own business, um, first off they come from some sort of background where they've done some sort of commission based or incentive-based work before, um, where they're used to being measured on the results of what they work for and they, and, and similarly, they understand that the progress is not linear. Um, getting good at sales or telemarketing or door knock, you know, door to door sales or whatever that is all requires, um, a level of wherewithal because in the beginning, you're not going to see much results, but after a few months, you'll see, you know, you, you might not make any money your first month doing telemarketing, but you might make you know, a hundred hundreds of thousands of dollars a year after a few years.
So it it's, again, people are more used to it coming from those professions, um, coming from a wage or a salary type job, you have to be cognizant that you're going to be much more, uh, You're going to be much more prone to quitting and stopping halfway through.
And as we all, as we know, you don't get the gold. If you go halfway to it, all the goals you have to get to the goal, do you have to go all the way to the goal? Um, uh, other other things I've seen have been, um, fo uh, the easiest, the easiest, the easiest number one thing that separates the successful people.
So I told you what separates the unsuccessful people out is that a lot of them, again, they're giving up wage and salary, the successful people, the number one thing is they surround themselves with other people working towards the same goals or that are already better yet that are doing the same sort of thing.
Um, many of the you know, I've had a number of students, probably almost a dozen now I believe that have, uh, earned over a million dollars doing affiliate marketing, which is pretty exciting. And some of, some of these folks, you know, one of my students has tens of millions of dollars, um, uh, just from literally coming from working a job before taking my training course. And now he has tens of millions of dollars, which is more money. He has more money than me now. Um, and the reason why he, and many of the other people who've made a million dollars plus in this industry or, you know, and what I train with people on, which is affiliate marketing is because he's surrounded himself with other affiliate marketers. He hung out with them. He did free work for them. He took my training course with any, he was in San Diego. He was located in a place where many other affiliate marketers are in other companies. And he went to take, he went to, but a lot of people live in San Diego that aren't successful in affiliate marketing.
She went the extra step to connect with those folks to go to events, to meet people, to get there, to go through that whole awkward process of a, Hey, I'm a dude, you're a dude, but like, You know, maybe we can like hang out sometime and we can, can I get your number? Cool, man. Cool. I don't know. I'm thinking of that, uh, that, that scene in fight club where, uh, uh, uh, Edward Norton was trying to ask Brad Pitt, um, for, uh, you know, if he could stay at his place after he blew up his apartment, um, And that, and, and, but people are so again, just like Edward Norton in that movie, people are so scared of imposing themselves on the world and really, truly living that they, they don't ask that person for their phone number.
They don't ask if they could talk later. Um, whereas the winners, they surround themselves with people moving in the same jet stream. And, uh, even if they're further ahead, You know, it doesn't matter if they're way further ahead. They are still in the same jet stream and they're following along. And, um, that's what makes them successful people proximity.
Joseph: [00:31:38] Yeah. I remember extracting that from one of the videos you had made, that was one of three about the importance of building your network and not being, uh, not, not letting your network be thrust upon you by just having the friends that we had grown up with, or, or a family, both of which I have.
Um, and, uh, incidentally enough, the friends that I have kept evolve. We've we've stuck around because we believe in forward momentum and we want to continue to support each other in that way, whatever that looks like. So that, that, that, that is a massive, and nowadays being, uh, online, it's a God, it's, it's never been so easy to, to reach out to people and just start building a network of like-minded people in a, in a way.
John Crestani: [00:32:17] Yeah. I'd say it. Yeah. It's, it's, it's never, it's never been easier because you know where everything is, you know, where everything's happening. The quality of conversation goes down and also the noise goes up for, for many people. Um, but yeah, I I'd say it's just unbelievably easy to reach people. And, and I mean, like people also forget, like there are so many really highly intelligent, old people out there who have already built massive marketing businesses, massive businesses doing outsourcing massive businesses, doing finance, massive businesses, doing real estate. And they were tired and they have all the time world. And, uh, nobody talks to them anymore. I mean, it is. So, you know, like wha why, why try to reach Elon Musk when you can find a thousand other billionaires who are retired that are just have nothing but free time.
And they're not necessarily going to be in their email, but if you catch them in the right place at the right time, you can forge connections with really anybody who's been anywhere in life. Uh it's. Yeah. It's absolutely incredible. It's it's, it's amazing. I mean, it's like, like what I used, I use LinkedIn, I use LinkedIn a lot to reach out to people and it just.
It boggles my mind, how easy it is that I'm getting in touch with folks who have built multi-billion dollar companies. And, uh, I get to talk to them, uh, for free, uh, you know, they give me advice. It's just, I, it just it's, it's so crazy and, uh, it's possible. And a lot of people don't take advantage of it. Most people.
Joseph: [00:34:09] Yeah. I mean, at this point I owe somebody a coffee, cause there's a punch card where if I say this eight times, you know, I owe him a coffee, which is that, uh, I'm in my, this is my job. So I get to talk to people such as yourself who have, uh, such immense impact and influence on the world. Um, I think w two to your point about Elon Musk, I think you made an amazing point and I hope people take away this, that there are so many people who can help us that aren't Elon Musk.
That's the thing is when somebody like him is at like, my exposure to him has like 90% been, um, coincidence, like is he comes up on the Twitter feed. Um, you've brought them up. Other people bring them up. I did deliberately go watch the episode he had on, on Joe Rogan, but that's because he was on my radar so much, so I can't help, but connect with them just because he's, you know, he's, he's, he's inundated in my, in my, in my usual algorithms. So, so there is that, that some of that connection is, is beyond our control, but we still have much more free will to, uh, affect that, edit that and do what you're recommending, which is to reach out to people who have the time and have already done the work.
John Crestani: [00:35:10] Yeah. Yeah, totally. Yeah, I've gotten, I'll kind of riff on that. I mean, what I've gotten into, uh, which I love to do this is like my new cool, like social hack is I try to find the best person ever at a specific activity. Um, like data analysis, for instance, or so, you know, uh, has been my kick recently. And um, finding product market fit was a previous one.
And I tried to find all the people in the world that have found product market fit, um, on a big scale, on a billion dollar scale. Now it's, it's really easy to name out a few of the people like Brian Chesky who founded Airbnb and, and, um, Stewart Butterfield who founded Slack. And, uh, you, you, some of these people, you know, uh, what is it, David who founded Weebly.
Right? You find these folks who have found a, who have solved a massive problem in business. Um, and you can't Google it. You can't say who are some people with interviews, who's on YouTube who have found product market fit. And whenever you're asking problems that whenever you're asking yourself questions, Uh, that cannot be Googled.
You're probably on the right track. Um, just with business, uh, because you're, you're, you're, you're getting in that means you're starting to get in real deep and, um, finding somebody does data analysis. Again, I'm looking at employees too. I'm looking at the first employees of Facebook. I'm looking at the first employees that created the algorithms at Instagram.
At, uh, at Google, you're looking for a very specific type of person and sometimes they're not even billionaires, you know, they're just there, they were merely an employee and understanding how they think about a particular area within business. Um, as opposed to what I've generally been doing is trying to understand their overall mindset is massively helpful. And I, and again, you can take that to any problem you want to solve. If it's starting a business again, there's so many resources out there. If you search how to start a business, the second caveat here is that if you look up how to start a business and you take advice from a random blog that shows up first from somebody who was paid unpaid article writer for.
Some website that does content. Um, that's not, you're not necessarily going to get the meat and potatoes. You want to hear how to start a business from somebody who has successfully started a business and preferably multiple businesses before. Um, so that's where, when you're fine, you, you gotta find, you know, specific problems are good, but you want specific problems you want.
The answers to those to be from people who have actually done it. And this goes on a whole other tangent, which is why business, a lot of business schools. Um, you're learning from professors, oftentimes who have, who are not successful, um, in their own careers, doing management or doing finance or doing, maybe if you want to learn how to get a finance job.
You learn from you. You can learn from your professor who had a finance job, but if you want to be an entrepreneur, the only way to do it, as you have to learn from somebody who's done what you've done before and, uh, this goes on another topic of like, I see these people that are completely unqualified to give business advice, giving advice online.
You know, we have, uh, you know, the online gurus have a whole host of people now that talk against us and it's harmful for people to take business advice from somebody who's never started a business and is just being negative. So it's, it's, uh, it's, it's tricky, but who you take advice from is so critical. It's something I spend a huge deal of time, um, figuring out for myself.
Joseph: [00:39:41] So here's something that I'm going to ask, and this is something that I, uh, I'm struggling with personally. And so I'm hoping that, you know, the listeners, uh, you know, hopefully they have this issue too. So at least this isn't a complete misuse of their time, but you know, it is kinda end of the day. So what my struggle is to elevate myself to the level of the people that I'm talking to.
Some of that there are solutions to that. Some of it is I'm starting, I've started my own, uh, online store. I'm working on my own little empire so that I will raise my bedrock and be able to not only understand the technique, better to ask better questions, um, to fear, you know, make it rent a little bit less.
I just kinda like get away from the system and more be on my own free stuff, which is, I know something that you're big on is freedom and breaking up this breaking free of the system. So my question to you is. Um, when you are reaching out to people who are, you know, they're, they're, they're billionaires, you said some of this about how you, you create a set of some urgency, and you're very like curt with the language, just to make sure that, you know, you show what you're up to, but within yourself is how are you, how do you get over?
If you get over it, the sense of like survival, you know, that cortisol running through the system, um, that, that, that nervousness, cause that's something that I would love to be able to deal with. At least get a really good grip on.
John Crestani: [00:41:00] Yeah. And, and that, that survival thing, right. That's going outside of our emotional comfortability range.
Um, that's really hard. And it's been, uh, I'll, I'll give an example because I don't like giving advice, but I, I can, I have personal experiences that can be drawn from. So last year we shifted, we made the shift from YouTube advertising to TV advertising completely. And it was simply because I'm the only marketer in my company.
I run a three person company, um, and, uh, we're trying to build software at the end of the day. Uh, are we, are we build software at the end of the day. So I'm really kind of the odd man out doing marketing and shifting from YouTube advertising. Again, we were spending around a hundred thousand a month and we would, or a week, I mean, and, um, we we paid that money off 30 days after the end of the month.
So the terms were monthly net 30. So I made money, day seven, and I didn't have to pay money back until day 60. Now the boat TV works the other way around. You have to pay for your TV advertising a month to two months in advance. You have to pay at least a month in advance. So I went from monthly net 30 terms to negative 30 day terms basically. Um, and that was a huge cashflow crunch because if you do the math, right, that is a, that is a pivot of about $1.2 million. Okay. That means. Because that that is, it uses a lot of cash, right? 400,000 a month and there's a three month difference. So it changes the whole equation around $1.2 million.
So even if I'm highly profitable on TV, it's still changing. The fact that instead of me getting paid first and then having to pay my expenses, 60 days later. Now, I, I get paid later and I have to pay for things 30 days upfront. And that was mentally wearing on me. That was really hard. And I knew it was going to be a very difficult period, because again, there's just a lot of.
When I'm, when I'm running a business, I like, you know, I've always run affiliate type businesses because I like, if I spend money, I make money. I want to see it. I want to see it happen. Like right that same day. I don't want to be like waiting on like, where's my money. And that was another reason why I didn't get into e-commerce like Amazon or drop shipping because.
Again, you're still, you're dealing with, you know, ordering stuff from, you know, you're paying for stuff in advance and, you know, waiting a month or two for it to get over from China and stocked and fulfilled. And so I just like, again, I like to keep the math simple and it was so wearing on me, seeing my bank account, just go down and down and down and down and down during this transitionary period while I.
But I knew the business was profitable. I knew that every dollar I spent on advertising made me back two or three or four. So why is my bank account going down? Right? In a cri a turn and for months I was living in this survival instinct because it just there's something there it's like, if I'm profitable, I should be making money.
But like, that's not always the way all businesses work with cashflow cycles. And I'm still convincing myself a bit as you hear me right now, because it's such a crazy concept. And, um, I created projections for myself. Um, I also just mentally prepared for this to happen, but the projections I put on spreadsheets allowed me to see that.
Okay. Basically it allowed me to see that there's going to be a six month period, which we are still at we're at the tail end of, and coming out of, there has to be a six month period where the cash just, it sucks and it looks like I'm losing money, but I know. I'm hitting my numbers and I'm profitable and I'm getting through it.
So that was really hard. But again, I had to take my emotions out of it. And I had to look at the actual numbers, the money, the whatever, and really just understand the business model. Um, that was probably one of the hardest things and we're still in it and it scares the shit out of me, you know, I I'm. I just, I was at the bank yesterday.
I sent a quarter million dollars away for, um, more TV ads. You know, it just, I want my bank account to only be growing, but it's just it's I dunno, it just works like that.
Joseph: [00:46:02] Well, I, I appreciated that before you got into that, you said that you don't like, uh, directly give advice, which is good. And I want to keep that in mind.
Cause I think generally it's better to hear stories and examples and stuff like that. Um, that I appreciate. And then I also appreciate the fact that. Well, I mean, not that it's something to celebrate, but the fact that you are, uh, you can, in your position still be in that survival is something that I look to, uh, unravel, uh, here on the show, which is, you know, we're all human beings and I I'm, I'm certain that a lot of the people that you talk to and that you reach out to, um, whatever level that they're at, they're in that instinct as well because they're bedrock and this is a term I started using like yesterday, their bedrock has elevated. So for them, they have a new bottom of that they could, uh, they could potentially get to, and they don't want to crack through that because then they lose their ability to info to have that influence that they're having.
Um, so it's, it's fascinating. And I guess in some ways it doesn't. It doesn't really go away. Um, I imagine, you know, even people who retire they're, there's, they're sitting around and they realize that they're losing time now they're not really doing anything. And maybe the survival instinct starts to kick in, in that way.
So it really it's, it's always going to be there. And I think that is probably the most important takeaway that I could extract from it.
John Crestani: [00:47:15] Yeah. I mean, it's, it's, it's exciting. There's all these little hacks, but the more, the more, you know, but finding out that I could find. You know, old people as mentors, uh, you know, it doesn't strike you right off the bat, or maybe it doesn't work in all industries or maybe it does.
I don't know. But again, you just, you create your own luck. The more, the more you're out there, the more you're trying to get deals and the more you're setting up ads, the more you're contacting the support, you know, Google ads, support desk are the more your posting and Facebook groups about specific problems you have, rather than keeping them to yourself.
The more you are opening yourself up to the world, and you're going to find, you're going to find those little gems. You're going to create your luck that way. You're not going to create your luck by holding your problems to yourself. Um, Uh, you're not going to create your luck by, uh, you know, just not spending the time to do research or to, you know, put up ads or to re you know, doing outreach or sales.
You're you're, you're not going to create your luck doing nothing. You're going to create your luck being out there and active and doing things that other people don't. So, you know, that's just been. You know, and, and similar to TV, right? Many people could have just looked at TV and said a quarter million dollars to do TV.
Why don't you just, you know, you're already running a profitable, you know, YouTube ads business. Why don't you just do keep doing YouTube ads and just do it a little bit different, but again, you miss a hundred percent of the shots you don't take. Um, so, um, You just, you just gotta be out there. I, every year I'm, I'm trying out, I try three things that scare the shit out of me.
Um, a few years ago it was, uh, learning to fly helicopters. Um, last year it was spending a hundred thousand dollars on a mastermind groups and like networking thing. Um, uh, it was hiring an advisor is spending another six figures hiring an advisor. That's an investment banker. Um, you know, and all these things scare the shit out of me because they have no, you know, I'm spending hundreds of thousands of dollars on all these little side bets that really have no direct any correlation to revenue, like zero there's, zero linkage to revenue with hiring an advisor.
It's like, let's listen to somebody talk for $10,000 an hour. Um, so you know, some workouts, some don't. You know, that mastermind group I was in, it's just kind of a waste of time and they're pitching us investment opportunities now, and also COVID happened and all this stuff. Um, but the infomercial had worked out, right?
So like that's my new business. And like that's scaling and doing millions of dollars a year now, you know? So it's like, But I want to found that if I didn't, if I didn't do those other two bets, that costs me hundreds of thousands of dollars that, uh, uh, that didn't work out. I wouldn't have had that third one, which did work out and has made me millions.
So. I don't know. Can I get better at it over time? Yeah, I'm sure. But I still, I still got to take shots. That's I still got to take risks that scare me and that other people aren't willing to do. Um, I believe in order to, uh, really grow my business in an abnormal way.
Joseph: [00:50:50] And there is a, it's not like one of the more common through lines that I observe on the program, but I have observed it is that there is a Renaissance of different mediums that while one might perceive them to either be outdated or on their way out, they actually just kind of revolutionized, um, I've talked to people in the past about postcards, sending postcards in the mail and the tangible postcard can.
You can connect with people. Uh, you've talked about television. I talked to somebody recently about a terrestrial radio. So all of these mediums can be revitalized and give you innovated and unique ways. And it's almost like the more people underestimate them. The more opportunity there is to find them.
John Crestani: [00:51:30] Yeah, one, uh, 100%. There's so many things that are annexed underestimate because everybody's talking about Facebook ads. Everybody's talking about Facebook ads and dropshipping.
You know, and, and, and so, you know, that, that's what everybody's talking about. So that's gotta be the best thing, right? Yeah. And, and yeah, you're right. But people, the, the problem is that, yeah, it's a great place to start, but you don't necessarily meet, you know, like you should try things again. We're, you know, it.
Facebook ads is one way. Yeah. Billboards, billboards, and bus benches and postcards. All of these ways are ways to reach people. It doesn't matter which one works. It's not like I care whether I'm building a business, that's advertising on TV or on Facebook or YouTube. It doesn't matter to me. I'm just, well, I'm just a crash test, dummy.
I'm just out there break and stuff to figure out I'm just out there trying different things because other people are other people are so. You know, they're so scared to go outside of that, the lanes of that training program, um, uh, and, and. They're just so scared to go outside of those lanes that, that they miss out on.
Um, the fun and the love of the process. And I like to think of it as a scientific process. Entrepreneurship is a scientific process. Um, it is you, you create, you know, in the scientific process, which was innovated by Isaac Newton, um, possibly the smartest man, you know, in the world or of our millennium.
Before Isaac Newton, there was like scientists just kind of like, they're just kind of like mixing things together. You know, a lot of alchemy, you know, a lot of scientists were alchemists or chemists, you know, they're just mixing things together and there wasn't a process. They were just kind of like, let's see what happens.
I don't know this, this like nights, you know, nitrous oxide, you know, we'll mix it with this metal or something, whereas Newton, what he did and why he advanced the world in such a dramatic way was because he said, okay, first. Before I embark on an experiment, I'm going to create a hypothesis. I believe if I do X, Y will happen and we can take the same.
We should take the same thing to business. I certainly do, as I say, if I do X, Y will happen. And if Y does not happen, then I figure out what, what, what, what was different? What. Was different. What changed? How was my thinking and correct? What various? Oh, maybe there's additional variables. Maybe if I. You know, if I'm profitable, if I'm to XR two X ROI on Facebook ads and I double my budget, I should get double the ROI, but it didn't happen.
Okay. You need to look at what other variables might I be missing out? Well, there's this whole thing about the algorithm and maybe, you know, like how the algorithm. Okay. Maybe if I just duplicate my ad group, maybe I just duplicate my campaign. It'll work out. But again, you have to really. Set that hypothesis first to figure out where you're going to be wrong.
And so many, uh, a lot of the entrepreneurs that don't do it right. Again, they come from wage or salary type jobs because they're taught you do a, then you do beat you clock in and you do a and every time you do a B hat. Um, or every time you do X Y happens, whereas an entrepreneurship, uh, and, and people come from the wage or salary jobs.
They just like flip out. They're like I did a, B and C, but I didn't get the result, what I it's all bunk. Right. They, their mind flips out because they can't deal with the uncertainty. Um, but human dynamics, sales, marketing, stock trading, real estate prices, demand, and supply capitalism is a human, uh, is a, is a market led by human dynamics.
Joseph: [00:55:42] Yeah, it's been fantastic. And, uh, and I, and I appreciate just being able to really hear your thought process and be able to share some of my own personal, um, questions with you as well. So, uh, it's been great. I had definitely got other stuff that I'd love to talk to you about someday, but we will table that for another day.
So for our listeners, um, we didn't get into John's backstory, but his backstory is on his YouTube. So John, tell us how to find you on YouTube and then we'll let you go.
John Crestani: [00:56:05] my name, John Crestani on YouTube.
Joseph: [00:56:07] Okay. Terrific. All right. Take everybody which I consume. Thanks for listening.
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