One of my favorite parts of doing this show is, while it’s an honor to deliver truckloads of value, most of which I’m implementing in real time, slowly but I’m doing it. We also get a chance to talk about the mindset and motivation that compels us to exit the system most of us are born into and take the reins. My talk with Kyle Plummer is all about that. It gets to the core of a simple question I should be asking more often “If you want to be free, what’s it going to take?”
Kyle Plummer is a 29-yr old ex-corporate pawn who turned internet entrepreneur. He has built multiple 7-figure dropshipping businesses from scratch over the last 5 years. You may have seen Kyle featured in publications like Yahoo Finance, Business Blurb, ABC, Fox, Or The Top 30 Entreprenuer's list. Kyle helps thousands to make money online through YouTube, paid courses and 1:1 mentorship.
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Kyle Plummer: [00:00:00] Let's focus on getting the first sale first. You're going to lose a hundred dollars to get the first sale, but after you get the first sale, you get a little bit of confidence. And then, then maybe the next week you get a couple sales in the next month or whatever it is, or you have your first profitable day.
Those are all things to celebrate, you know, and if you're to someone that is not getting sales, realize that you took a step in the right place. You, you put yourself out there, you took a risk, you built the store. That's a really impressive thing to do. To actually put this stuff in action. It's really easy to go watch a video and feel inspired.
And the next thing never think about it again, but to actually watch a video, feel inspired and go do it. That's, you know, pat yourself on the back. And then from there, every step is just building on that confidence and realizing this stuff is real.
Joseph: [00:00:50] You're listening to Ecomonics, a Debutify podcast. Your resource for one of the kind of insights into the world of e-commerce and business in the modern age. This is Joseph. I'll be presenting a wealth of industry knowledge from interviews with successful business people and our own state-of-the-art research. Your time is valuable so let's go.
One of my favorite parts of doing this show is in addition to delivering truckloads of value, some of which we're going to get to you today, most of which, by the way, I'm implementing in real time. Slowly, but I'm doing it. We also get a chance to talk about the mindset and motivation that compels us to exit the system most of us are born into and take the rein. My talk with Kyle Plummer is all about that. It gets to the core of a simple question I should be asking more often myself. If you want to be free, what's it going to take?
Kyle Plummer. It is good to have you here on Ecomonics. How are you doing today? How you feeling?
Kyle Plummer: [00:01:46] I'm good. I'm good. You know, as good as you can be in a lockdown here, I'm, I'm, I'm feeling good than productive this morning and excited to be here.
Joseph: [00:01:55] Awesome. Yeah, me too. You know, I remember some of the earlier conversations I've had, I, I did ask more pandemic questions or earlier on, and a lot of people were saying, you know, I'm, I'm so sick of it.
I can't wait to get me too. Any men at any minute now we'll be free. Yeah. Uh, you know, we, we we released these like two months after we record them. Uh, so hopefully we have ourselves an optimistic summer, but that is everything that I'm going to say on the lad there subject.
Kyle Plummer: [00:02:22] We'll cross our fingers.
Joseph: [00:02:23] Crossed fingers off today.
Kyle Plummer: [00:02:25] We can hope we can be dreamers. Right.
Joseph: [00:02:26] Exactly. All right. Opening question. Uh, you, you know, what's coming, our audience knows what's coming. It's a, well, it's not just our show. Most shows do this. And there is no better question to start us off with, which is tell us who you are and what do you do.
Kyle Plummer: [00:02:40] Yeah. Yeah. Uh, my name's do kind of want the backstory of how are we want to get into that stuff later. Just maybe just kind of give a overview of what it is that I do or?
Joseph: [00:02:50] Yeah. Usually I structured this question as the overview. Some people will use it as a backstory, which I'm fine with. So, you know, if you feel like the backstory is important to characterize what you're doing now, then go for it.
All right. Sounds good.
Kyle Plummer: [00:03:03] But, uh, yeah, I, I, Kyle Plummer. 29, going to be 30 in a month, just crazy to say. Just a normal guy. Um, I do e-commerce drop shipping. I think you're, most of your listeners are familiar with drop shipping, basically buy and sell stuff online, never see touch or smell the products, um, enabled to build some stores from scratch up to seven figures is what I've known for on Tik TOK. I'm on YouTube teaching people, this stuff as well for a couple of years, been in the game for five years. Um, yeah, crazy stuff. I can't, I can't believe the stuff that I do. I never thought I'd do this. And, uh, yeah, that's kind of the, kind of the backstory.
Joseph: [00:03:41] Yeah, well, you know, you're, uh, you're in, you're definitely in drop shipping country here. You know, we're a, we're a Shopify theme and, uh, where I I've for one take great pride in being able to share those information and these stories, especially because, um, what I was asked on a show that I was a guest of is, you know, what is the thing in common with people? And the number one thing that's in common, as cheesy as it sounds, it's freedom.
It's people having the ability to be able to do and say, as they please, to an extent, I do remember seeing something very particular about how like, no, you, you, this becomes your baby. You know, you do have to be attentive to it 24/7 it's it's not, I mean, there are advantages to a, uh, to a formulate, a nine to five structure.
And one of them is that, you know, when you don't have to worry about it, you know, you have your, you have your weekend, it's, you, you can take your mind off of it. Um, whereas, you know, in this environment, there is a lot of that going to sleep, waking up, checking in on it, going off on a trip, being with parents, regardless of where you are, what you're up to, you do have to check in on it. So, uh, yeah.
Kyle Plummer: [00:04:46] I was just saying, that's an interesting point because, you know, we always talk all the time about, you know, e-commerce and working for yourself and freedom. And I go in a lot of lives. I just like to connect with people, my followers and whatnot. And they're always like, oh, what's the biggest mistake you've made. The biggest mistake you made. And it's, it's ties into kind of what you just mentioned is that. You always have to be on, right. I'm flexible. If I want to go golfing today or hop on a podcast like this, I have the flexibility to do so, but the work is still there. Right? When I get home from golf or I get off the podcast.
I still have to do whatever that thing is. And when I first started doing this and I was, I was still working a full-time job, a nine to five, and I was starting to have success with this business. Right. And I ended up going on a vacation with my parents, I think, like a week or so. And I was like, you know what?
The business is pretty automated. I'm going to just leave it for a couple of days. We'll come back, we'll check. I've got, you know, these virtual assistants working on the business. And I came back. Wasn't really worried about it. Couple of days later, open up, I got messages from my virtual assistant. I've got just all these inquiries from customers.
I'm like, you know, what's going on here? And I look into, and it turns out on my Shopify, you know, how you can put in inventory numbers and you can also select, like, if there's no inventory, then they can still order off the, off the, um, the store. Well, the inventory hit zero, even though my supplier still had tens of thousands of units of this product.
And I was spending, I don't know, maybe 2000, $3,000 a day in Facebook ads over those two days, nobody could order. And I obviously, you don't get your money back on Facebook ads out above five or $6,000 because I had taken a break from the business. I said, oh, well, it's, it's good to go. Um, so that was the lesson that I learned early on that you just always have to be taken care of it.
Like you said, it's your baby. You can't leave your baby out in the crib for two days. You have to go and see what's going on. Check in with it. I thought the business was good, but that was a lesson I learned early on that you. Seven days a week, we've got to do something. We've got to be on top of it. Even though you have employees that are working when they work and keeping on top of their stuff, you have to know what's going on, especially when you're spending a thousand dollars a day or $2,000 a day in ads. And that was, that was something I learned. But yeah, it's kinda to your point, it's, it's really important to, um, you know, work around the clock, even though you do have the freedom.
Joseph: [00:07:17] So I'm going to ask you, uh, two questions, uh, about this. One of them is that, so if you were to have taken that vacation now, uh, how would you manage your time so that you could properly disconnect for a minute?
Would you have just like woken up, checking it out for a few hours before you start your day? Uh, maybe check it out the end of the day. How would you have dealt with it? Knowing what you know now?
Kyle Plummer: [00:07:35] Yeah, I, you know, typically the way I work with my drop shipping businesses, you know, there's a, there's a lot of creative work that I do in the, in the mornings and the afternoons. And when I check on the businesses, I still look at the same way. You know, I, I look not, maybe not first thing in the morning. I like to get up and maybe hang out for a bit. I don't want to get into, you know, co you know, putting out some fires and whatnot, but I'll check it.
I'll check it pretty early morning just to make sure everything's running any issues like that. Any customer issues I need to resolve, I'll check one time over lunch and do anything I need to cause that kind of determines my day. You know, if I was on vacation, maybe I I'd figure out a way where I'm not hopefully getting too deep into some fire, but I'll check it, you know, during that to noon, just make sure it's good because I have that PTSD in my mind now that, that, that thing happened to me. And I can't have a vacation knowing that maybe something in the background's happening, I need to be on top of it. But then I'll check maybe at night as well before I go to bed and just have that peace of mind, you know, there's nothing better than having a peace of mind just to make sure that the business is running.
And there are no issues, even though it is kind of, you're constantly doing this, you can't take a full day off, but yeah, I'll check it periodically.
Joseph: [00:08:53] Right. It's just, it's more interwoven with, um, uh, with a person's lifestyle. And, and one thing that I noticed, you know, as an entrepreneur too, and I will say that like, in my, in my journey of this, I wasn't doing e-commerce prior to this, I was doing some stuff.
Like, I dunno if I, if I want her to stretch the point, maybe I could qualify it as e-commerce, but it's okay. I don't need to die on that hill. But now having talked to so many people, it's hard not to be inspired. And so I set up my own store, obviously I got Debutify having my back. So one thing I noticed about the entrepreneurial mindset is that even if I was working, say, you know, my, my retail jobs, my sales jobs, I was thinking about it all the time.
Even when I wasn't working there, it was still on my mind because I'm trying to think of like, these are going to be the problems that are going to be there when I get back to work. So if I don't think about it, my Monday is going to be a lot harder, even if I technically have Saturday, Sunday off and the, and that mindset.
And it's like, well, if I have this mindset, I might as well just like, you know, do it my own way anyways.
Kyle Plummer: [00:09:53] Yeah, yeah, exactly. No, that's, that's kind of the, you know, and, and we might get into this a little later, but when I was working in my nine to five and granted there's definitely better ones than the ones I had.
Um, the boss really made it a point to make me think about the job over the weekend. And I always hated that because it was, you know, I was younger. I was 21, 22, 23. And I wanted to have that break where I wasn't thinking about it. So when I came Monday, I didn't have to, you know, I didn't want to solve the problems before they happen.
I wanted Mondays when I'm going to think about it, whatever. And then as I've been doing the entrepreneur stuff and building these stores, I've actually enjoyed kind of having my mind on it. And you, you really can't turn it off, but just constantly working towards it and, and, and making it better and better and building it up.
And, you know, I hate the saying, like, you know, if, if you know, you enjoy what you're doing, you don't work a day in your job, you know, a day in your life type thing. But at the same point, it kind of gets that way. It kind of gets, this is kind of your purpose and what you enjoy doing. And yeah, it's just, it kind of comes with the space.
Joseph: [00:11:03] There was another point too, that I wanted to touch on briefly. Just, we, we both talked about how, like, you know, there's businesses are our babies and like psychologically. My, my parents, you know, they'll all, even though I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm a, I'm maturing. I'm 31 now. Uh, and I'm a bit of a late bloomer, but you know, there's, there's still a ways to go, no matter what, I'm going to have my own kids, I'm going to be on TV, whatever could possibly happen in the future.
They'll always see me as my baby or as their baby. So, and I, and I think the same thing is true here in, in, in a business. So he reaches maturity. Other people are working on it. You have VAs, but no matter what, it's always going to be your baby just in your mindset, because it was your creation.
Kyle Plummer: [00:11:44] Exactly, exactly. And that was, I didn't understand that when I, when I worked in corporate, my boss never had kids. And a lot of the people that were, you know, employees of the business did and, and, and, you know, they didn't necessarily understand. Uh, my boss, the president of this company, working around the clock, going go into bed at midnight, wake up at 4:00 AM to get back at it every day.
Doesn't matter if it's a Sunday or it's a pump it's a Monday, and they didn't understand that the ones that had the kids, but, you know, they made it that made that connection kind of what you just did where, you know, th this is her baby, you know, this is something that she has to take care of, you know, especially cause it's our livelihood.
If it doesn't work out then, but that's, she, she has employees taken care of. And, and, uh, you know, obviously that's how she makes her money as well. And I didn't get that until I started to do it myself. And then you really understand that this is something that you're always thinking about and you want to make sure it's, it's growing just like.
Those little, uh, if you ever had those Tamagotchi little things as a, as a kid, you know, you're constantly working and feeding it and giving it water and watching it grow and, and the bigger it gets, the more that it's different than a kid. Cause when it's kinda grown, it does its own thing, but you, you almost get more involved.
I feel like you get more employees involved. So you're kind of, they're part of the team and you're looking out for them and, and you want to just keep building and building and building. And in that aspect, I feel like you're almost more involved as it does grow, depending on what routes you go. You know, maybe if you're in dropshipping, sometimes you kind of reach a cap and you're, you're done with it. But if you're building a big brand, sometimes you're more involved.
Joseph: [00:13:23] Yeah. That's a, that's an interesting point. I mean, I suppose there are, um, you know, human beings who their parents actually don't relinquish. In fact, they, they get a firmer grip and then you've you see people who like, you know, they, they are, um, they joined the family business.
You know, they become an asset to the parents and they they're, they're raised to the level of their parents because in terms of a maturity, you know, it's, there, there are peaks, you know, like 40 or 50 or whatever the metrics are. Whereas youngsters, they grow up, they get to be like 20, they get to the thirties and they could almost meet their parents at the same level now, just because there's no more teeth, there's no more set of teeth to grow. And, uh, there's no more, you know, there's no education. So yeah, that's a, that's an interesting point. I didn't, I didn't consider that.
Kyle Plummer: [00:14:02] I've never really thought about it that way. But as I was talking, I was like, you know what, sometimes you, well, you, you see sometimes with drop shippers, you know, they, they get into the business because you know, people ask me all the time, they say is drop shipping easy all the time.
All the questions, is it as easy as everyone makes it seem, you know, can you, can I really make money in the first month? All this stuff. I'm like, don't, I can't really say that. And I, I would never position that, because I think that's not true. This model is simple, you know, you can, you can start something for very low.
Some people are starting for almost $0. Obviously you have to get a Shopify plan. Yeah. Um, all these different things, but it's very low investment it's anybody can do it. No, you don't have to be a expert in marketing or building websites or have an MBA, you know, you can get started. But the, so the process is very simple and I heard Gary V the other day, he was saying he was actually reviewing the drop-shipping.
He does the overrated underrated. Have you ever seen, you never seen it? He basically, if someone gives them a topic and he says either it's overrated or underrated, so, you know, for instance, take time, is it over it under it? And obviously everyone now would maybe say it's kind of skewing towards at anyways.
He actually got the question with dropshipping and he said it was it's overrated for people that have been doing it for a long time, you've developed a skillset, you know, that how to build a website and get these products set up and you should be building a hundred million dollar brands, whereas it's underrated to most people, because it's a really easy thing to get started. Now, it's not easy to become successful, but to get started, there's a lot, there's a lot less barriers to entry when it comes to that. And I've always viewed it that way, that this is kind of an entry point for people to get into it and eventually maybe do go and build a brand.
Um, and so that's kind of, that's kind of always stuck with me is, is, is, you know, if you're going out into, you know, build a big brand, it does require a lot of work and. I think some people in the space do miss out on that opportunity, um, including myself. But yeah, in that case, I would think you you'd have to develop a new skill set and it would take you more time and they would, it would really be your baby at that point, if it's, if you're private labeling and, and building a brand that you hopefully have an exit for, you know, down the road.
Joseph: [00:16:16] Well, w I guess my take on, uh, on drop shipping, just, you know, from my, a unique perspective, getting to talk to so many people and getting like the, this nexus of, uh, of information, which is it's overrated when people put the, the method above everything else, because it's just the fulfillment, it's the, the business still adheres to the principles that make businesses work.
It still adheres to the principles of marketing. As you, you, you present a problem to the consumer and then you offer them the solution. Simple. And so I think what happens is the gold rush effect where everyone is drawn to this simple method of, well, I don't even have to touch it. Like, as you say, touch it, see it, smell it.
In some cases, drink it, rub it on your face, whatever it is, you don't have to do any of that. And the product is already proven because it's there. Other people are buying it. So that allure is I think the overrated part. But if, if one things I, I had to do and that I encourage everybody to do is to recalibrate what's important. What's important is what problem do I want to solve for other people?
Kyle Plummer: [00:17:18] It's a good point too, in terms of the problem solving. And I think a lot of people that get into the space, they, they focus too much on the business model that they don't, they don't get to the problem solving. You know, we're not just out here trying to sell whatever products you have to look at it.
Hey, if I'm a customer I'm working hard. I don't, most people are working hard. You, I work in their job and, and they come home and. Most people don't have extra money to just throw around your product, right. It really has to be something that's going to make their life easier. And you can't just put anything out there.
And a lot of people just don't have the perspective and that's something that I think people need to hone in on is what are, what are you actually solving or what is, what is the main problem? And there's a lot of problem solving products out there, but I feel like people don't understand that sometimes.
And that's a big reason not successful is, is it, it can't just be anything, right? It's not 2013. You can't just have a fidget spinner. Now that did solve a problem, solve a major problem. Probably not. You know, it, it was something cool to have, but there's a lot of cool products out there that I think are doing some cool things.
And people from the outside, they view dropshippers a certain way, a certain stigma towards it. But these are the same products that we're buying. It doesn't matter if we're getting it from Amazon or some random website or we're going down the streets, a Walmart or whatever the case is the, these are real products. And when you kind of flip over that stigma, then I think the game really changes.
Joseph: [00:18:42] Yeah. And, uh, and, and, and one of the other stigmas too, which is the, the markup. Right. And I, and I know that you've, uh, you've observed this too cause, cause I, the nice thing about tiktok, cause I can get through like a bunch of tiktoks in the span of a minute, uh, which is that somebody is selling a product for, um, about like $20.
Then you go into Alibaba or Ali express and it's being sold for $3. And the stigma there is, well, hold on a second. What's I feel like I'm being ripped off and I understand that. Um, my perspective is this I, uh, I'm, I'm wearing right now, these, uh, these, these spandex gloves that are supposed to help minimize arthritis, uh, cause I'm a gamer too.
Right. So, you know, I, my, my hands they've certainly pulling their weight.
Kyle Plummer: [00:19:23] I think, I think we are all, we all are at this point in the pandemic. I think everyone's gotten a little bit into video games, you know?
Joseph: [00:19:29] I hope so. I, I feel like, uh, uh, you know, I think games are great. They keep your mind sharp. I think they remind people about fun and add to youthfulness, but yeah.
Yeah. Uh, I had to put a little knick cause otherwise I will go off on a tangent.
Kyle Plummer: [00:19:43] Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Well, we'll say that for the end.
Joseph: [00:19:46] The thing was, um, I had to be marketed these gloves. I didn't know about them. I didn't know. They existed a marketer comes along, advertises them on Facebook. I discovered them through their marketing work and then I buy the product from them at $20.
And then. Uh, I, I know there are, um, a dropshipping expert who I talked to, uh, probably a couple of months ago. Now, at this point, he does a video specifically about those gloves. I'm like, oh, I should've figured these gloves are on ali express aren't they? I go into ali express and I spent $20 worth. So now I have, I gave myself one, I gave one to my girlfriend and then I have another one in, in reserve.
So like, okay, I see past the veil now, but I feel fine having, given that $20 to them because they did the marketing, they sold me on the idea. They changed my thinking. They, they did a lot of work that is not as tangible as just selling the product. And that's where I think there's a lot of disconnect too, from the seller side, which is, this is why marketing is key.
And my boss, he's, he's all about the marketing. He says, marketing is everything is that you have to change people's minds. You have to offer them knowledge that actually grows them in some way, shape or form. And then, and then the money is, is the reward for, for that work you've done. And the product is. I mean, it's part of it, but the solution is always psychological.
It's something deeper than just what the problem does. Like a sleep mask for instance, helps me fall asleep at night, but it's not going to cure insomnia. And not that I have that, but there's psychology. There are there's research there's habits. How do I improve my day? And as marketers, we have to do our part to continue to encourage people, to, to reshape their life in a way that we see fit.
Kyle Plummer: [00:21:21] Yeah. That's such a good point. And I feel like I don't talk about that enough and that's, that's a really good point that I, I think subconsciously, I think, but I never really brought up, you know, if, if you, if you walk into you guys on a where you're, where you're living in a grocery store, we have Hy-Vee they called Hy-Vee's around here.
Uh, it's a, it's a Midwest thing, but, um, no frills have no frills. No.
Joseph: [00:21:45] Oh, they're so good. It's just like, it's like, it's like anti branding. It's like no name products, but a whole grocery store.
Kyle Plummer: [00:21:52] So that's kinda my point. That's what this Hy-Vee is, is they're they're a brand, cause they're obviously they've got a name stores, whatever, but you walk into them and you've got a mixture of, of different things.
It's like every grocery store, right. You got the name brand stuff, and then you've got the, they always call it the knockoff or whatever else. Right. So you walk in there and you notice that a lot of the generic store brand ones are a lot cheaper. Well, what, what, I mean, what's really going on there right there.
The reason that they don't have to compete on the same level and other ones have to, is because you're already in their store. Right. So they they've already done the marketing to get you there. And then with the other brands, they spend a lot of money on advertising to get that in your mindset. Oh, I want to, you know, I need the captain crunch, you know, I don't want the, the captain crunch, you know, not the knockoff brand or, um, you know, whatever your brand of oatmeal is or milk or cheese, they spend a lot of money on advertising to get that in your, in your minds to pay for that.
So what are you really paying for? You're paying for the loyalty you're paying for the years of you watching those commercials and everything that costs money, same thing with the, you know, the iPhones, right? You want the iPhone, you want the brand and you, you know, you kinda people, people don't like that.
People are like, oh, why do I pay 1200? Well, the demand's there. Right. Um, but you know, they, they spent years advertising and getting, getting that in the branding and everything. Now, obviously with what we're doing, a lot of people don't necessarily do the branding and whatever, but like you said, they, they do the work to get you to their store.
Um, a lot of people ask me all the time. Cause I do Shopify drop shipping, drop shipping. There's Amazon FBA, you know, eBay drop ship, all this stuff. So people like, oh, why don't they just get it from Amazon? Well, I, I control the traffic, right? I ran the Facebook ads, Instagram ads, Pinterest, Google, whatever it is, they're in my store.
As long as I can show them that it has value and that I'm legitimate. Yeah. You're gonna have people that go to Amazon every now and then. But as long as I convinced them that this is where to find this product, then they're probably going to buy from me. Right. But it's, it's all in the work, you know, it's, it's like you said, you, you are, you deserve it.
Right. You, you paid for it. So why are they doing Ali express or Alibaba? They, they might not know it's out there and you you've, you've done the work.
Joseph: [00:24:07] And, and, and if they ended up seeing past that veil, then, then so be it, there's a, there's still more people out there who. Yup. Don't have those gloves for those hands and they need it.
I bet you, I could start up my own store and sell these gloves myself if I wanted to. And I'm sure there's lots of people didn't know about it. So it's, it's, it's, it's all in our mind is like our, how do we do our favors and how do we, how do we meet it? How do we be honest with ourselves about that? And, and that's what I think separates a lot of people, but like, yeah.
So that's, by the way, you know, would help. If I made a sale myself first, before I really started, it's just, for me, it's just all been a, just the information that I've collected and I, and I've had the, the luxury and the really the honor to be able to process the information and, and share it with others.
So, uh, it's, it's, it's a privilege to be able to make the points that I do.
We, we, we've alluded to your backstory and we've heard like bits and pieces of it, but it is a really critical part of your journey. And it's a through line throughout the show is to hear what people have were up to prior to e-commerce. So, um, there's, there's a central question that I'd like to ask as well as like, if any of what your prior experience, uh, came with you in the form of skills.
So I would like to keep that in mind, but, uh, tell us the, uh, tell us a story about the, you know, where you were living, where you were working and the, the day that changed your mind.
Kyle Plummer: [00:25:29] Yeah. I'll, I'll kind of go a little bit back because people ask me, did you go to college? Did you go to high school? I, you know, I went through high school.
Mom was a teacher, so I got pretty good decent grades. I got to college and my whole life was kind of built around. Not really decisions I felt like I was making, it was just, this is what was my parents wanted me to do. I didn't have a choice of going to college, not going to college. I was going to, especially back then.
You may see a lot of these kids. I say, I said this last night on live, that these kids have the options to go into whatever they want. That wasn't really cool because you're you and I are kind of similar age that wasn't it. At least from where I live. Uh, it wasn't really cool to go do an entrepreneurship.
Like it was weird if you don't go to college. Right. I don't know if that was the case for you. Um.
Joseph: [00:26:11] I, I went to a, an arts program, um, here in Toronto, we have a, the Humber college school of comedy, uh, which already has a whole can of worms, whatever I say. Cause people expect me to just start being like way funnier when it actually, it has the opposite effect.
It was like, oh, you're an expert on it. Are you? But it was about like, it was like an industry insight. We learned how to write the craft and all of that. So it was, it was cool. But even choosing a program can get weird, looks, let alone, choosing to go to school in the first place. Yeah. Whereas now you see the study is about how many people they get their degrees and then they ended up baristas. And I think it's gotten to the point now where people get weird looks if they do go to school.
Kyle Plummer: [00:26:49] Yeah, exactly. But anyways, yeah. I mean, the point is like, I didn't really have an option. I was going to college. I had no idea what I was going to do. I didn't think I was going to be an entrepreneur, went to school for marketing business marketing.
And, you know, kind of to your point, you were saying that helped you in this business. And, and my background will kind of get my backgrounds, you know, maybe I wait until I'll explain my background as well. But anyway, so I went to got a degree in marketing. I wasn't a great student, you know, I was a good student in high school because I was at home.
My mom's a teacher. She kind of forced that for me, got to college, more of a partier, you know, from being honest, I, I didn't, I wasn't as good with the school stuff. I think I was made for school. I could have done well with it. I just didn't take it seriously enough. And kind of skimp by a little bit until I ended up graduating in four years, took the last year pretty serious, but I felt that I didn't know what I wanted to do.
You know, I went to school for marketing. I didn't, you know, marketing is so broad. You can go into all sorts of different stuff. And I was interviewing for jobs. I never did an internship or anything like that. And I wasn't getting hired. I was, I was, I wasn't really getting interviews, you know, surprise to me.
I didn't get good grades. And I ended up getting an internship at this training company. One of my buddies, moms had, was working here at the time and they said, I, you know, I know you're in marketing, I've got this internship at this company. I know you're looking for a full-time job, but it's a good way for you to experience.
And I said, you know what, I'm going to take it. Went, there was there for about two, three months. They knew I had graduated at point. This is after I graduated. Right. So I was about three months in, they said, you know what, we're going to hire you on full-time kind of still felt like my life was being determined for me.
You know, I didn't, I didn't have options for jobs. Got this internship. Now this offering me a job. All right, I'll do it. No idea what the corporate life was going to be about. Right. I think when you're in college, you think that you're gonna get paid all this amount of money. You're going to be rich, have the house, the cars, the trips.
And that's true for some people, but it wasn't true for my situation. I was very underpaid. I felt like when I was at age, I felt like it was underpaid and I didn't have a whole lot of money, but I just, I didn't know any different. I was, I was just in the mode where I'm going to work this job. And I was in a different state than where my parents were.
Right. I was kind of working this, do my own thing was there for a couple of years. And I, you know, they were kinda at the point where they didn't, I wasn't the best employee. I didn't, I didn't really surprise people in terms of that. I wasn't. Uh, I, I just wasn't that great because I wasn't motivated, I wasn't passionate to do anything.
I mean, I was doing data entry and, and, um, you know, scheduling and doing some small stuff. I wasn't doing a whole lot of marketing and they were kind of transitioning me to the marketing, but I never really proved myself. I never really spoke up and share my ideas or had opinions. Uh, I was a lot more shy back then and I didn't like it.
You know, I was sitting there and just like, I didn't like it. The atmosphere was intense. I was dressed up. I was wearing, you know, suit and tie and all that stuff, doing the networking events. And everybody was so fake. And it was a, it was a, who was who it was, oh, that's the CEO. He won't talk to you, what's your title and where do you work?
And that depended upon how they valued me and everything. And I never really liked that, but I didn't know any different. I thought that this is the world. Everyone talks about the nine to five being a grind and you know, less than ideal. And I really felt that after college. And it was about maybe three years in.
I thought to myself, you know what I need to, I need to make a change. I just, I can't do this. I don't know if I work for somebody else or if I try to look up, I, you know, maybe it's something online. I don't know. I didn't, there wasn't as many options back there I feel like is now, you know, now you go on TikTok and YouTube it's you can, this is how you can make a hundred dollars in 15 seconds.
And I feel like that stuff wasn't around back then. And what I decided was I need to make extra money first. Right. That was my first thing. I, I was, you know, I kind of told you before and you kind of maybe heard it on a tiktok you said that I was living in affordable housing. Now it wasn't, I don't want to make it sound like it was terrible.
It just meant that I was making less than a certain amount at the time and yeah, special housing and the housing main, I mean, it wasn't that great, but it wasn't, I'm not living in a van down by the river type thing. My mind was, am broke. I am working at this job that I don't like started getting some credit cards and running up these credit cards.
And I just felt that I couldn't do anything. Um, kind of a funny thing I do say, but it's true thing is that I I'd go around the bars downtown and I could not buy drinks for girls at the bar. You know, they say not to, I actually couldn't, I couldn't, I couldn't buy a tab. I couldn't buy a round for people.
I couldn't take any trips. I couldn't buy new shoes or anything. I mean, I didn't, I didn't really have any money. And so that paired with the job thing I thought to myself, man, I need to get money somehow. And. I don't know, just going on YouTube. Right. I think everyone's kind of had that moment, at least maybe thought about it, just type in how to make money online.
And there were just dozens and dozens of videos. I think you could do it now. It'd be overwhelming at the time. And it felt like it was maybe three things. It was, um, well, I, I only really saw affiliate marketing because I had heard about affiliate marketing before. And I was like, you know what, I'm going to go.
This affiliate marketing, what is this sort of watching the videos, bought the courses, set all this stuff up and I'm getting ready to launch. And I ended up because of my search history on YouTube, you know, I love YouTube for that reason. It started to show up, um, you know, similar related videos of how to make money online.
And one of them was this guy that was basically saying how we made, I don't remember the exact title of it, but you see them all over the place. How I made 10,000 in 30 days is that now what I'm gonna check that out, started watching this video. And I was like, you know what? That just seems less. I don't want to say scammy.
They feel the marketing thing. I don't want to hate on people that do that, but at the time, that's what I thought. I thought this just seems weird when I buy these random email lists and started emailing these people that I don't know for offers, this sounded like something that was, you know, in my control.
And, uh, you know, I was like, you know, what, if I could just make an extra thousand $2,000 a month, I can get myself a little bit out of this debt. They have my bills. Get ahead a little bit and maybe just leave my job if I can't find a new one, because I really didn't like it. I w I wasn't having a good time there.
I didn't like my boss and I was ready to get out. So I was like, maybe I can just do this and make some money, build my first store. And I zero sales. And that went on for the first two months. You know, people ask me all the time. How long does it take to be successful? I can't give you an answer. I just, I can't give you an answer.
I'm sorry. First two months of doing this, I was spending money. I didn't have, but I felt I had some belief in myself. Right. I was thinking I don't have an option. I think everyone gets to that point where if you give up, I think it's because you didn't have to do it. You know or you didn't want it enough now. I don't know if you feel that way, but I feel like a lot of people, they try things for a week or two weeks and they decide it's not going to work.
And that wasn't me at that time. I just felt like I had to do this. I had to make this work. So the first two months was tough. I didn't make any money. Fortunately, I was part of some Facebook groups that other people just start this out. And they were saying how they made some, their first sales. And I thought to myself, if I can just make one sale, I can at least have confidence that this is real because at the time I just didn't think it was real.
But of course people are buying stuff online. Right. So it has to be real. Randomly I shut off my ads, ads. I probably, at this point I lost maybe a thousand dollars, something like that. And I had my Shopify open, had the notification open. Everyone's probably heard the ding is listening. You know, your viewership.
I think a lot of people, people are familiar with that. Um, my phone's out in the other room, all of a sudden I hear that Shopify ding. And I said, wait, I never heard that before besides another other people's videos. And I walk out there and sure enough, I had a notification saying I made a 19.99 sale.
And I thought I was thinking, wait, what? I'm not even running ads. This is a day later or two days later, make sure it's still legit. Look at it. Look at the fraud levels, whatever, everything checks out. Okay. Send them an email just to make sure, because I didn't know what was going on. It was weird because like I said, I hadn't, I hadn't been running ads at the time.
Sure enough. It turned out to be real. And I thought, I thought, you know what? I got to keep doing this. I got to figure it out. Maybe that's not the right product because I couldn't, I didn't seem to have things going with that. Tests on other products. And that got me on a wave of just constantly building stores and testing stuff.
Until four months later, I had my first profitable week. And through that time I built confidence based on just getting sales and proving the process until I finally broke through. And then eight months later it became a realtime income. I was starting to make that maybe 1 to 2K 3K extra a month until eventually I was making more doing the drop-shipping stuff than I was at this job that I hated.
And I ended up staying at that job, you know, for two years while I was doing this. And I, and I knew, you know, very well that I was making more money doing this than I was at the job that I hated when I felt trapped. I felt like I couldn't get out. And it's interesting to hear that, you know, Debutify as so, uh, cool with you doing your own thing.
My boss was not., the corporate was not cool with that. They didn't want you to do your own thing. In fact, I had a employee before I left that my boss, the president of company based, came to me and said, hey, I know that this, you know, this person is doing social media for this dentist and you need to tell them that that's not okay.
And I'm thinking to myself why it's not really, it's a totally different industry. It's not a conflict of interest. They're young. They're trying to figure they're not, they're probably not going to work here long time. I think we all know that. Right. And she basically made me go and talk to them about it where I felt there was a moral dilemma, because I was also doing this other stuff on the side.
It wasn't a conflict of interest because it was a different industry. And I don't know, I just felt really sour about that. And, um, but that was the kind of environment I was in. It just felt like I was trapped. And so eventually I just ended up walking out of the job entirely. Cause I was like, I'm doing this full time and I'm making money doing it.
And I finally made the jump, but you know, that's, that's a little bit of the backstory. I know I kinda got long-winded on it, but yeah, it was.
Joseph: [00:37:50] Well, I was happy to hear it. Um, and w well, one thing I'll say it just about my position is that not only are they cool with it, but I'm encouraged to do it. Uh, I I'm compelled to do it.
Uh, I mean, some of it has to do with the fact that, you know, we could make gobs of money, so that, that does help. But, um, uh, that has to do with the product that I'm selling. Uh I'm I, I know there are some, um, a lot of people in this space are protective of their products in the interest of learning and openness.
I don't care for this particular one, but you see these drawers that you stick underneath desks that can create free up more space. Like, I really liked that I would use that. And, and I'm ordering them. Um, and now I'm learning how many things can go wrong. Uh, on side, we ended up, um, ordering one that I'm not going to sell in particular, the particular model, the adhesive didn't work.
So my girlfriend and I, we woke up in the middle of the night to this, like slamming him at what, what was that? And I'm like, oh no, please don't be the juror. Please don't be the drawer I turned on the flashlight. It was the drawer. So I'm like, all right, uh, I'm gonna, and I apparently me at that early in the morning, um, are where I'm at peak cortisol of.
So I'm like, I'll come back to bed. And the second I go into the other room, I grabbed the drawer and I started smashing and hasn't done. So I'm drawing out a different one, uh, uh, hopefully to get that one, that one should work out, but this is, this is the kind of thing that can go wrong. So I'm learning a lot of that, but I do generally like the product.
So there's, there's that side of it. Uh, and then, you know, there's, there's multiple sides of it. Uh, another one is too is just like, how could I not, like, if I'm learning all this information and I'm trying to compel others to take these same steps to earn their freedom. Well, I basically have to like I have to prove if with all the information, with all the resources and all the help that I'm getting.
I, uh, no one else on the planet has fewer excuses than I do to, to make it work. So, uh, there's definitely a lot going on there. And the company has been very, very supportive of that. Um, but I just wanted to, uh, give them their, their due.
Kyle Plummer: [00:39:40] I mean, it helps you understand the company you work for to the people that would work with Debutify and use Debutify and I, you know, I didn't understand that piece. I get the, from my boss perspective. Right. And you heard all the time, if your energy is, you know, spread out between several different things where your mind's at. Then you're maybe not focused on the job at hand, right?
Joseph: [00:40:08] Yeah. And I think that's what happened with your, uh, why they wanted their, your coworker to not do the social media.
Even if it wasn't a conflict of interest, it was just an energy expenditure. They didn't want her to use her energy on that.
Kyle Plummer: [00:40:19] Yeah. And, and I get that, but she was in a role that she was doing our social media. And I thought to myself, if she's doing social media, maybe 50% more a day, and I don't know how much she was doing, then she's going to get better at it. She's going to be honestly, in that flow of if you're doing social media or if you're building websites or if you're doing advertising, the more you do something, the better you get. It's just, you know, if you're doing the right stuff, obviously, you know, there's a right and wrong thing to focus on. But that's why I never understood with when I was doing my own thing.
I eventually moved in, I guess I didn't tell it part of the story, but when I moved from more of a data entry into the marketing role down the road, and to me working on these stores, I was learning more about marketing as I was doing it. So instead of me working, you know, 40 hours a week, I was maybe maybe 50 to 60 hours that I was focusing on the skill set and that stuff.
I know for a fact, I was bringing in better techniques and strategies for the business that I was working for. But again, I never told them that because I know that they would put a kibosh on it. Not that I was violating any, any sort of conflict of interest, but that was just a, it was a toxic environment. And I know a lot of people can relate to that for different, different reasons.
Joseph: [00:41:40] And it makes me wonder too about cause you were, you were, you got to the point where you were earning more money, um, through your entrepreneurship than you were at the company, and yet you still felt trapped and I'm wondering if you felt trapped and it was a psychological thing where you felt like they had ownership of your life and it was up to them to decide if you were going to continue working with them or not, because that was like kind of a through line with what you had experienced up to that point where a lot of what you had been doing was, um, because you were compelled to do it.
Kyle Plummer: [00:42:08] Yeah. It, it was part of it. And I was, the other part was, I mean, yeah, unknowingly. I feel like they kind of brainwashed me and this and she was good at it. So obviously I won't name any names or anything. One of the smartest women I've ever met and the company was built on. Uh, corporate training. We would teach people how to give presentations on neuro-linguistic programming, like psychology, everything.
And she was really good. She knew what she was doing. She knew how to keep people. And when you're in a place for, I was there maybe six years, you, you a get comfortable, it would be they're working on you. They want you to stay. They're doing different things. They teach this and I'm not, not me trying to be like conspiracy there's I knew what she was doing. I could tell. And it was also a small company. And so you feel, you feel like you're a part of something, uh, greater. It gives you a sense of purpose, um, which we can talk about that later, but I felt like I was part of the company and I had been working on some projects for a long, long time that I couldn't just walk away from, even though the money is over here, I'm making more money doing this stuff.
I just felt I couldn't break free. It's a weird feeling to describe you probably have that with some other things, you just feel that, that you just can't leave. And it's just, it's the weirdest, most crippling thing you wake up in the morning and you think to yourself, man, I don't want to go into work, but I feel like I have to.
Joseph: [00:43:36] I I've been, I've been struggling with this concept for a while because, um, this is going to get pretty loo.
Um, so, so for those, you are not a fan of the woowoo. I just don't know what to tell you, but, um, it's, it's the struggle between free will and predestination and, and I think you have certainly struggled with how much of your life is to lay it out for you. And maybe not in like in a cosmic sense, but in, in, in the practical sense of like, you know, this, this is the structure that you're in and, and you know, like here, here's what clicked about me.
And this is where a game gets to come into. This is, um, Dungeons and dragons. And for those of you wondering, I have brought this up before in the outro night episode. Uh, so I am keeping track of this. There, there is a scenario where there's this, uh, there's this child and it's like corrupted by a demon, starts lashing out, trying to kill people.
Uh, I, the palliate and I take a swing at her. Um, she takes damage and then she runs for it and then we'll head outside and she's hiding in the woods. And, uh, and she's hiding. I'm like, she's experiencing fear. I can't hurt her. Cause you know, that's, that's, that's just palette and things. And then the, you know, my, my rope pulls out on arrow shoots are dead.
I'm like, all right, well, I try and everybody at the table was like, why God can you just kill her already? And like, and, and the thing about predestination and structure is that you always have free will, but, but systemization, and even on a cosmic level, It's like the dungeon master. It's trying to set things up for you in advance.
It's in maybe, maybe they know, maybe they think they, they think they know what they're doing. Maybe they do. Maybe they don't, but all of this is laid out for us. And so we always have the ability to, to veer off from that and go our own way. But imagine if I did that in a Dungeons and dragons session, now the DM has to improvise and be like, well, you know what, in fact, I think I'm just gonna go around smashing everybody's windows.
It's like, oh, well, the townsfolk were very upset with you. The authorities come in. So that's just the point that I wanted to make, because I am firmly of the opinion that pre free will and predestination both exist. And we ha it's our it's it falls on us to exercise our free will, because if we don't then at the very least something, is there waiting for us anyway.
Kyle Plummer: [00:45:44] Yeah, I agree. I think, and I feel the longer that you don't exercise that the harder it becomes, because as I said, if I was working this job for two years, it would have probably been easier for me to go and exercise my free will, but the longer I was there, I felt like it just, it kept trapping me and trapping me, trapped me to a point where it was really hard for me.
And in fact, I had to just, I couldn't even face my boss to tell them I was leaving. I just had to go. And, uh, yeah, it's, it's an interesting, it's an interesting world. And, and that, you know, I see this with my friends all the time, too, exactly to your point that they just need to realize that. But the second you, you kind of hear what you just said.
I think people will maybe try to make a decision and, and, uh, break whatever it is.
Joseph: [00:46:38] Yeah. I, I do think just, you know, hearing your own story too, cause you're saying that. You know, if the, if you don't actually, if you don't use it, you lose it. Um, I do think there is a, uh, a variant of that, which is the pressure builds and the longer that pressure builds, then at some point it reached a tipping point and then you make your own way.
And I think that's, what's happening to you is that that pressure was building like, as you're, you're stuck in this cycle, you're, you're, you're that you you're in affordable housing, but you still have to pay something I assume. Uh, and then this job is, is, is eating away your energy and you can't even buy a drink at the bar.
So that pressure builds up and, and that manifests into this freewill. That's been there all along. It says finally, there is a reason to do it because it comes with risk. It's, it's a higher degree of risk.
Kyle Plummer: [00:47:22] Exactly. That's a good point too. You know, I, there's nothing greater than having a reason to do something. I, I see, you know, the tiktok audience is very young and I see a lot of people that. They tried to get in drop shipping and they don't have a reason. They haven't experienced hardships with maybe a job they hated. If you're 16, you haven't had the real life experience. And I think that's, what's different than some of these younger kids who are teaching this stuff as they haven't really had a reason to maybe they did, maybe they didn't want to work in the job, but when you've actually worked in the job you hate, then you get to a point where you're going to do anything you can, whether it's get a new job or do something for yourself.
And like you said, it just builds up. It just builds and builds and builds and sell. It gets to a point where you don't have any other option. You're going to go and make whatever happened. And it doesn't matter any sort of thing that comes up. That's less than appealing. It's not going to be worse than what you're currently living, or at least you believe that.
And, uh, yeah, that's, that's a good point. It does. It does. It does build up until it reaches a point. And there was a, there was a bunch of times where I would take out those frustrations and meetings and I would, I would act out because I was frustrated and it wasn't a professional thing to do, but it, it builds up.
It's something heavy on you. And when you wake up in the morning and your thoughts go on your commute to work, you feel that pressure that you're talking about, you feel it.
Joseph: [00:48:54] By the way, if you're a current user of Debutify or haven't tried this out yet, Debutify version three has been released and now is a good time to upgrade or get started as any. A streamlined user interface along with an ever increasing array of conversion boosting add-ons is waiting for you. So download today for free and start here at journey. Who knows, maybe I'll be interviewing you before too long.
Here, here, here's a bit of a, a gear shift. Uh, that I wanted to ask you, uh, particularly about that, that first sale you got actually I'll chamber that. Cause there's another important point to make here too. Just about, um, I've uh, from your story, I've heard this happen a couple of times where once people started putting money into e-commerce and there was a lot of losses and there was a lot of hard lessons learned and it's like, just when you thought it's going to get low, it can get a lot lower and the lower it gets, the higher that you rise out of it.
So I'm wondering about your, your mindset at that point where, you know, did you feel like, okay, um, this isn't it, or did you, at that point, was your, your determination so strong that you were able to power through the, the, the lower point and the losses that you were incurring?
Kyle Plummer: [00:50:01] Something I learned a long time ago and I don't know where I learned it is. Yeah. I mean, for lack of a better word, it does suck when you're working and working, working at this thing. And it seems that you're getting deeper and deeper down the hole in it. But my mindset, I never felt defeated. I think a lot of people do and what I encourage them to switch their mindset too, is, is small wins.
It's really hard for you to start a business and be successful the first month. And I think a lot of people put their energy into that, and it's great that they have those goals, but let's first let's focus on getting the first sale first. Maybe you're going to lose a hundred dollars to get the first sale, but after you get the first sale, you get a little bit of confidence.
And then, then maybe the next week you get a couple of sales or the next month or whatever it is, or you have your first profitable day. Those are the things to celebrate. You know, I, and I, I think I learned that in corporate, I have a lot of great lessons from corporate, so I never take that experience away.
And that was one of it. You know, you're not, not every day is going to be a win, but if you can find something in the business model that you feel like you're improving on, then that's going to keep you motivated. You know, I think people getting the perspective that they focus on all the other people around them.
And guess what? I do that all the time, too. Especially if you're in those Facebook groups that kind of get a little, you get hurt a little, but when you're seeing, hey, this person made their first six figure month or whatever, I'm in the Facebook groups, people just like me. I'm thinking to myself, why can't that be me?
What am I doing wrong? And it's also motivating at the same time, but I, you know, I'd be lying. If I said it didn't hurt to see that and know that you feel like you're putting in the effort, you're just not getting the results. But what you have to realize is there's people out there that they haven't even gotten a sale yet.
And if you're to someone that is not getting sales, realize that you took a step in the right place, you put yourself out there, you took a risk, you built the store. That's a really impressive thing to do. To actually put this stuff in action. It's really easy to go watch a video and feel inspired. And the next thing you, you go off and never think about it again, but to actually watch a video feel inspired and go do it. That's, you know, pat yourself on the back. And then from there, every step is just building on that confidence and, and realizing this stuff is real. So I, you know, to answer your question, I really didn't feel that I was in a position to get too down on myself. It hurt, it definitely hurt not being able to have the immediate success, but I always focused on the small wins.
Joseph: [00:52:27] Yeah. I, I would say just, you know, coming back to it to my own perspective too, like I've, like I mentioned, I've talked to a, a lot of people, and I don't exactly talk to failures on the show.
I had talked to view who was succeeded and the more people I talked to, the more my worldview expands and it gives me more peace of mind that there's room for me as well. You know, if I had talked to like one person who was like an e-commerce master and I didn't talk to anybody else, I would feel like it's.
The industry itself is more limiting because there's only one person to talk to. When in reality, I look at my calendar right now. I got people booked months in advance, and there's an every time I think, have we gotten like the majority of the people yet to talk to, and the answer to myself as if we're not even close, we still, I I'll, I'll like, I'll go like, uh, the LA the previous guests, um, uh, Christian Lovrecich.
He does his podcast. So I go on his podcast and I look at all the guests names and I recognize a few. I talked to that guy. I talked to that guy, but there's another 50, 60, 70 people I have not seen before in my life. So my takeaway on that and just like people who are in that position, where if they get cheese, when they see other people succeed and they fail it, you can, you can be inspired by the fact that the world is big enough for another person to, to enter into, uh, and, and to get to that level as well.
Kyle Plummer: [00:53:45] Yeah, exactly, exactly. A hundred percent agree. And that's the cool thing about podcasts. And even, you know, maybe if you're not on podcasts contributing, but being able to bounce around and like you said, I mean, it's crazy. I can hop on YouTube or hop on a, you know, the podcast app and just, there's so many different people talking about success stories, and it's the, you know, there's just so many, there's so many, and it's a good point to realize that there's so much room for everyone to have their own success and to build out whatever they want to do. They just need to get, get over the excuses. Right?
Joseph: [00:54:20] Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Uh, so one of the things that you said about is, you know, that first, that first sale, that first win and, and it draws from the other question that I had chambered, which is. So you turned off your ads, but then you got your first deal afterwards.
Do you understand how that sale happened? Was somebody like on the website, they had bookmarked it and maybe they came back afterwards. I'm just, I'm just curious how it managed the sale post the ad.
Kyle Plummer: [00:54:45] Never looked into it and sometimes it happens that yeah. Maybe somebody had saved the, say my video on Facebook or maybe Nancy sent Betty an email link a while ago and they just didn't get around to it.
Or maybe somebody who's waiting until they had a paycheck or I can't, I couldn't figure it out. And to be honest, I didn't want to like question it. It's, like I said, I wanted to reach out to her. And are you sure you want me to edit say, are you sure you want to make a purchase? You're the only person that ever had to purchase something on the site, but yeah, I don't know.
I don't know what happens if it was motivating though. It was, it was weird, but it was, it was motivating for me to keep going for sure.
Joseph: [00:55:26] Okay. Uh, I'll I'm gonna, I'm going to try this anyways. Did you want to take a guess at what might've been the, what might've been the case.
Kyle Plummer: [00:55:33] I don't know. I, I want to say that somebody had tagged some, this is probably my best guess somebody had tagged somebody on the Facebook post and the comments and they didn't look at it until a couple days later. That's my best guess.
Joseph: [00:55:49] Yeah. Fair enough. I was, I was just, I was just curious about that one. Yeah. I'm just going to look at my, uh, my question list here. All right, here we go. Question two. Uh, actually, well, so this was something that you had, um, you had, you had mentioned, um, earlier on about like, you didn't want to take fully away from the corporate experience because it did give you some skills, uh, and some positive takeaways.
Uh, I, you have to forgive me. I can't recall every lesson that was said, uh, this last hour, because I'm just soaking in as much information as I can, but if there's anything uniquely you want to say to that, I'd love to hear, like, what were some of the. Uh, the positive takeaways, skills, mindsets habits, anything that corporate world corporate America, or whatever you want to say, uh, uh, did for you.
Kyle Plummer: [00:56:30] Yeah, absolutely. And for me, it's probably important to note that I, I wasn't, I'm not very detail oriented naturally. And so when I came in the corporate world, it gave me structure, it allowed me to, I worked for a small business. And what that allowed me to do is understand how they're thinking, why these meetings are structured, the way, what talking points, how to set goals.
I got into being able to talk to people too. I just, I felt for me, I was very immature. When I came out of college, I just didn't develop looking at where I'm at now. I just didn't develop in the same way. It allowed me how, you know, to be able to sit in a meeting and, and bounce around ideas and how to effectively tackle problems.
I also got into management a bit, so I learned how to delegate, you know, all that stuff's transferable. When we talk about building a store, you know, how do you delegate what to delegate, just how to effectively do it? I think, I think that stuff, you know, a lot of people will go out and they'll say, hey, should I hire out people to do the website? Or should I hire people to do the ads and all this stuff? And what I say to them, because I learned from corporate is that you should at least have an understanding of what's you're delegating because A, someone's going to go charge whatever they want to charge for it. And B, you don't know how much time is required to do that sort of stuff.
Right? If they're the expert, obviously there'll can be a little bit faster, but if you have no base level of how long it takes to build a website, then they could potentially be taking advantage of you. And that was something that in corporate was that you should know what you're, what you're delegating out.
Don't just like blindly throw it out and let people decide price points and, and what time is required. Um, so that was really important. What else? I think just being around, you know, although I didn't like it, I was around motivated people. Uh, we were a training company, like I said, and, and we were really focused on making people be better, better leaders, presenters, salespeople.
And that was something that helped me. You know, they always say the cliche, you are the sum of the five people you're around most type thing. I, I think I became motivated working there. I became motivated about reading books, became motivated about listening to podcasts, learning, growing, taking action, you know, being around those people, if they were tired or they were sick, they didn't make any excuse.
You know, it wasn't a sick day for them. It was, I have to get this done, all that stuff was instilled to me throughout that time. And I think it transferred into what I do now and then, but that's not always the case with, with corporate, you know, that was just my experience and what I took away from it.
Joseph: [00:59:03] Right. Well, I think just because the corporation, the whole business was about motivation. There's certainly the, a thematic, like almost like a motif to the work that you're doing. And so you're it, you're surrounded by that. I feel like the question would be very different if you're working for textiles, you know?
Kyle Plummer: [00:59:19] Yeah, yeah, exactly. Exactly.
Joseph: [00:59:22] So we, uh, we're on the cusp of a, of an hour here. Uh I'm uh, I could, I could wrap up, but I'm having such a good time. I don't know. Uh, what should I do? So.
Kyle Plummer: [00:59:31] I'm here for whatever I'm having a good time. I didn't know. We were, we went an hour here.
Joseph: [00:59:35] Yeah. It, it just, uh, it just, it just flies by, I watch everything like a Hawk, right?
Like I'm micromanaging. So I'm looking at the time and making sure it recordings are so go and check on my questions. Uh, having a conversation with you, it is taking a while to get to this point. And let me tell you, so, uh, here's, here's something that I'd love for you to share with our audience? Um, I haven't seen anybody, uh, uh, suggest this before.
Uh, it's the, the list of a hundred things. I mean, I, I could try to characterize it myself, but that would be following. So I'd rather just, uh, I'd love to hear your take on it. And I'd love to hear like how it's impacted you personally and like how many things you've gotten on that list.
Kyle Plummer: [01:00:10] Yeah. And this idea didn't come from me. I can't remember where it came from, but w typically when people write goals, they, they sit down and maybe they write, I don't know, 10 goals or something like that. They're all related to maybe career goals, fitness goals, relationship goals, whatever it is. But. I kinda ran into this, I don't know, maybe a year ago or something.
And instead of maybe just writing, you know, maybe a small list, let's start out a very, very big list. I want to chunk, you know, take on a lot of things. And basically the process is this. You can do it at the start of the year. And a lot of people do the new year's resolution stuff. I don't necessarily believe in that stuff, but it depends on, I think when you're motivated to do it right, you do it the same time every year.
Maybe you write a date at the top of the notepad, but you sit down and you write 100 goals and it doesn't matter. They can be smaller or big. They could be simple things. I want to go visit Italy or, you know, maybe I, I want to get a new job. I mean, they don't have to be, you know, obviously the more specific with goal setting the better, but it can be a hodgepodge of stuff between financial goals or career goals, or like I said, fitness or relationship, whatever it is, write those a hundred things down.
And your goal with the goals is to focus on those. You read those every single day in the morning. So they're instilled in your head, you know, you're, you're mapping out kind of where you're focusing. It should be at, right? The things that you kind of pay attention to usually happen. And you're just trying to get, you're trying to cross them off throughout the time.
You're trying to reach all those goals. Now. I don't think you should be pressured to feel like you should. I have to knock all a hundred out. You know, you don't want to be perfect. I always say to people it's okay. It has to be consistent with things you don't want to give things 110% for a week. You want to be, not give it 99% for a lot longer.
And so with this thing, you're not your goal. Isn't to be perfect, but you want to, you want to make a good, you know, you want to make way on it basically. And so after that year is done, you look at the list, you've seen all the things you've done. And hopefully you've crossed off a lot. I'm guessing most people probably won't get a hundred things done if they do they're overshooting.
That's awesome. But just take all those things that you didn't get put onto a new list and start over from there. And I see the other, the other question, a piece to that you were asking how it impacted my life. It just makes you more, it makes you more productive, makes you more focus and you just get a lot done.
You know, I was just naturally that way, like I said, most people just kind of put out 10 goals. The thing is I feel that we necessarily don't get a hundred percent of the things we do. So if I write 10 things, maybe I get seven done, right. Because I get 70% done. But if I have a hundred, I'm getting 70 things done.
And so that, I mean, just having the 10 times factor just by nature, by math, you get 10 times more stuff done. I think, I think that's really important. It's something interesting and people say. Well, how am I going to wake up and read the a hundred things? Whatever you just have to get in the habit of it.
You just have to say, I'm going to do this for 30 days and actually you do it for 30 days, then you can't imagine not doing it. And it gets easier and easier. It becomes part of your routine, same thing with meditation or exercise. You just have to fit in your schedule and realize that's really important.
It's not something that is just kind of a no for gazy, whatever it's it's this is something that's determining how you, how your, your goal is, how your mindset is and, uh, yeah, it's, it's impacted my life for sure.
Joseph: [01:03:44] Do you by any chance to watch the Wolf of wall street? Yeah, I re I saw that scene. I rewatched it Bacani and it's for Casey it's for Gazi.
Cool. So a couple of things I'll say to that, and then, uh, I'll get you on outta here, and by the way, door's always open more than happy to have you back for a, for another conversation. So, uh, uh, just, just so you know, I love to do another hour with you.
Kyle Plummer: [01:04:09] Yeah, I, I appreciate it. I, I think, uh, some of the things we couldn't get into, um, telling my story, so maybe we can get more into the mindset motivation pieces and specific questions too.
Joseph: [01:04:22] Yeah. Uh, sounds good. I, I I've, I've got, I still got them saved, so I'll hold onto them for next time. Um, so one, I just want to make a point about new year's cause this one doesn't come up too much, but um, somebody had to change my mind about the whole new year's resolutions thing.
And what she said was try not to look at it as a chance for resolution, but as a chance for revelation to look at our year in the past and say, well, what did we do? What would we like to work on? Um, cause that is a metric for like, okay, well where, where was I a year ago? And you know, I, this I'm in my apartment now and, uh, and it was just the first new year's I celebrated my apartment.
I thought, yeah, I, uh, okay. This is different. Definitely a lot changed. So it didn't, I didn't feel like, okay, well now I've got to hit the gym the next day because hey, I couldn't, but be okay. It just, you know, it was, it was a different way to look at this milestone that I have no control over anyways. The next thing I wanted to say is, as far as like exercise, go in particular, that's what had been a, it's been a sticking point for me for a long time, because it's hard to have fun with exercise and the recency bias being a thing here is my girlfriend got me into the just dance series on the, uh, on, uh, on the PlayStation and it's good exercise.
And it brings up the competitive side to try to like, match the, uh, the dancer on screen. And so I'm like, this is actually pretty good. I'm pretty good. I work up a sweat with this.
Kyle Plummer: [01:05:41] Yeah, yeah. If you can. I mean, if you can find some fun with it and that's that's with anything, you know, I mean, if it's exercising or building a business, you know, not everything is fun, but if you can have some sort of reward for you doing it, you know, obviously rewards are usually it's short term just to get you into it.
You have to have a real reason to do it. Um, one of the points I kind of alluded at a little bit was. You have to have a life for why you're doing something, right. It can't be, it can't be a situation where you're going to just do it because you feel like it's the right thing to do. That was the, we kind of said it earlier with, uh, I had to do this.
I had to get out of that job. That was my why I didn't want to work in corporate. And the same thing with exercise, you have to have a why, you know, maybe your, your strong point is you want to be healthy. You want to live longer. Um, or if you want to like look good or be your best self, whatever, whatever that, why that strong root cause is that stuff helps.
But also you can, yeah. It's if you have something kind of fun to, to switch it up, that definitely adds to it as well.
Joseph: [01:06:44] A hundred percent. So, and the last thing I wanted to say too, just for our audience is that, um, I, myself, um, I'm going to do with this a hundred listing, uh, and I recommend people to like this, wouldn't be here, this just do it, do it, do it the same day.
You listen to it. And the reason why is because, well, Why not, I can, I I'm thinking about it and what I'm looking forward to is how it's going to expand my mind in terms of like, well, I'm not going to write down anything that I'm not capable of doing. So if I can write down a hundred things that I'm capable of doing, and that in of itself, um, improves my confidence.
Now, there is one thing on there that's rather meme and absurd, which is I've always wanted to drop, kick a whale. Why? I don't know. I just really have always wanted to take a crack at it. So that would, I don't know if I'm going to get to it, but everything else realistic.
Kyle Plummer: [01:07:28] Yeah. Yeah. It, it definitely, it allows you to do some stuff that you probably would have never done.
And also for the people that are the list, crossers, you know, people like to make lists and cross things off. It makes you feel good. It makes you feel like you're making progress. I can tell you're definitely that person just by us setting up the podcast. I'm not that person. Um, I usually lose my lists.
But everyone feels good about crossing stuff up and making, uh, crossing stuff off and making progress. And that's another important piece about it is that you're actually working towards something. It gives you a purpose for your, your, I just floating around, you know, and, you know, beyond just the fact that you're, you're trying a lot of new things and kind of molding yourself over the year.
Joseph: [01:08:08] Exactly. And with that, um, we're gonna, we're gonna wrap this, this one up. So the final question, um, which is isn't two parts. One of them is let the audience know where they can find you check out your content and maybe get in touch with you if they'd like to maybe be coached by you. Um, but prior to that, just a chance to say any final words, final wisdom, stuff like that, just in case, not that you haven't given us plenty already, but just putting it out there one more chance.
So take it away and then we'll, we'll get you on.
Kyle Plummer: [01:08:37] Yeah, I'll just, I'll mention where you can find me first. Uh, you can just search me on YouTube. Kyle Plummer, Instagram Kyle Plummer official, TikTok Kyle Plummer official. The best way to reach out to me is probably Instagram. And then, I mean, what I want to say, and I, I'm not sure who needs to hear this, but I get asked all the time.
What's the biggest reason for people being successful or what's the biggest hangup or what's the biggest key to, to making things happen. And honestly, I, I don't think that people believe they can make it happen, right? 99% of people fail in something because they don't, they don't have enough belief in themselves.
They don't think they deserve it. And what I tell people is you have to understand that you do deserve it. You're good enough to make whatever happened and anyone that's done, anything has started where you're at. I don't know where you're trying to get to, but it's just a matter of focusing in realizing that you can make it happen.
Be confident in yourself and pushing through the barriers because everything's going to, it's not a, it's not a flat path, right? There's always going to be rocks in the road and potholes and. Things that trip over, but you just have to push through what 99% of people, one push through. That's it, that's it.
Joseph: [01:09:46] All right. And with that, uh, to our audience as always, I am, uh, beyond a honor to be able to share this information with you and to collect it in a way that's very uniquely Joseph. So thank you for on occasion, putting up with my quirks. But other than that, Kyle, it's been a, it's been great talking to you. Great to meet you too, by the way. It's just, uh, uh, I, I just, I find not, I feel better, but I feel different since like an hour ago. So, you know, it's just, uh, it's great to, uh, enjoy this step on my own journey as well. So with that to our audience, take care and we'll check in soon.
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